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When the Christless Come Home for Christmas
by Matt Kaufman on 12/10/2009 at 8:30 PM

What's an atheist to do at Christmas? That's the topic of an Associated Press story on the subject. "Food, we like. Presents, we like. Seeing family, we like," says one. But, of course, that's not what Christmas is all about, and some chafe at the abundance of explicitly Christian activities and expressions. (Grumbles one, about his Christian mother: She "believes all that c__p.")

I'm not sure the people in this story are typical atheists, if there is such a thing. Most seem to be members of an atheist group (presumably that's how the reporter found them) who observe things like "Winter Solstice" activities. But there's a much larger number of less hardcore unbelievers, as many of us know firsthand: They're in our families. For us, the question is: What do we do when they come home for Christmas?

That can be a hard question to answer: Each case is so different, tangled up in individual family-relationship dynamics. All we can do here is to think about some general guidelines and try to apply them to our own families.

We don't want to promote family tensions and conflicts. We also don't want to turn Christmas into a lowest-common-denominator event where Christ is treated as an optional accessory. We'd like to find ways to witness. But we can't browbeat loved ones into faith and we shouldn't try. And we mustn't hide our faith to avoid discomfort either.

For those of you with non-Christians in the family: How do you walk that line? And (optional bonus question) do you think you've been taking the right approach, or have you gotten off track sometimes?

Hat tip to my friend Mollie Ziegler Hemingway, who put me onto this story.

Comments

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1

Christmas is interesting to say the least on my father's side of the family. Growing up my grandparents were "christian" in that they were "good" people. My aunt disavowed any religion. As children we were pretty outspoken about the real reason for Christmas. It got trickier as we grew-up. Then my aunt converted to Judaism and started celebrating Hanukkah.
If anything Jesus related comes up we answer frankly but don't dwell on it or cause it to become an argument.



2

One family tradition we have is reading Luke 2:1-20 before opening presents. It started with Grandpa, and has been rotated through all the grandkids and, now, great-grandkids. It's always been that way, so the non-Christians go along with it.

Though, for those without an older generation providing leadership, I suggest hosting the family gathering. Yes, this requires buying a bigger house. But then you can decorate that house with a Nativity Scene and other specifically Christian decorations. And, for those who want to de-emphasize Santa, decorate accordingly. It's quite easy for the children of non-Christian relatives to be curious about something like a Nativity Scene. They'll probably be perceptive enough to notice Santa missing, too.

One of my neighbors is on the corner lot. He always decorates for Christmas, as do I. But coming home one night this week, I was struck by how prominently his Nativity-Scene cutout sits on the corner of the lawn as we turn down the street. No reindeer or santas in his yard, either.



3

I think frankness and honesty (and good humor :o) are the most useful tools when you're getting together with people who don't believe as you do. I think you've just got to focus on your own celebration... If a family member who doesn't believe in God sees that you really do believe, and that you are having an authentic experience of worship or joy, it's harder for them to be cynical, and they will be more likely to respect your beliefs because they see them for what they really are instead of as an abstract concept.

I think that simply being authentically involved in the experience of God is the best testimony you can give.



4

I start out the day with prayer usually.

It's sometimes so easy for non-believers to be caught up in the Christmas Commotion of the Kitchen.

My idea is that we approach the day prayerfully and ask God to give us wisdom to live out the message even after the Lunch is done.



5

Good article. If you want your loved ones to come to faith, you have to always and all the time testify about Jesus Christi without wavering and use every opportunity. And it will hurt, it will hurt deeply when they reject you, when they sneer at you, when they gossip about you and when they attack you openly or behind your back. But if you want to succeed and your loved ones in your family to believe, you have to hold on and persist while continuing to show them that you love them and genuinely care for them. All people have many prejudices and many misconceptions about God, many bad experiences with other religious people, many misunderstandings due to bad theology, so one needs to overcome all these in order to properly communicate the message of the gospel. And make no mistake, this takes lots of effort, and requires persistence and lots of patience and steadfastness. That’s why it can be done only for people that you really love as it may cause you so much pain and hurt. However, the rewards may outweigh the temporary pain and troubles. But, please prepare yourselves well for your battles with good testimony and always treat others with great gentleness without pushing them to make an immediate decision on Jesus now (trust me the other way around is not good at all), and know that after all, everyone has a free choice and you cannot force them to accept Jesus – even with your best arguments and great love and testimony they can still reject God.



6

My sister converted to Jehovah's Witnesses, so she no longer celebrates holidays. She just had her first baby and it is going to be heartbreaking not to have them around the tree on Christmas morning. My family and I have faith and hope in the Lord that she will be convicted again someday by the true Word that was written on her heart in her youth.
Christmas is not a time for a family battle. It is a time to pray even more for our unbelieving relatives. It is an opportunity for us to reflect our Savior in our celebrations, our interactions, and our love.



7

I honestly don't know how to deal with it. My family is for them most part "Christian" (in that they believe that Jesus is messiah, but it doesn't really affect their day-to-day lives at all), and some of my cousins are outright atheists.

This is probably a terrible way to deal with it, but I generally just try to stay quiet and avoid arguments. Table conversation almost always turns into something vulgar/Christian bashing. When that happens I usually just get up and leave. They have the right to talk about whatever they want, but I don't have to participate.

If I even try to voice an opinion, I usually get shot down by about 4 people. It's rough. If anyone has any advice for what to do in a family like mine, I would appreciate the advice.



8

speaking as someone who no longer believes:

i go to mass on christmas with my family, more to keep everyone happy and spend time with my loved ones. other than that, everyone is pretty cordial about the religious belief issue. even my grandmother (who has reached the age where she no longer cares what anyone thinks about what she says)keeps the questions to a minimum.



9

My mom is Jewish, along with all of that side of the family and my dad was rasied Catholic, along with all of his side of the family. As you can imagine, this can lead to an interesting dynamic. In the Lord's sovereignty and amazing grace, He chose for me and my 3 siblings to come to a saving knowledge of Him as teenagers. I have made many, many mistakes through the years--most with good inentions--when it comes to witnessing to my family. What I have learned is that prayer is the most important factor. I have to pray over my family memebers, my time with them, and over myself. Satan seems to enjoy attacking me when there might be opportuniteis to witness Christ's love to my family. I've also learned that living my life for Christ and showing my family what His love looks like through my actions and love for them is sometimes more powerful than speaking it to them. Don't get me wrong, there are def. times when speaking Truth and the Gospel are necessary, also. Praying for opportunities, then for the boldness to act on those opportunities, then for the words to speak is so, so important. Lord willing there will be a day where my parents (and other family members) will be rejoicing in their salvation with me, but until that day i will continue to pray for their salvation and live my life intentionally and purposefully for Christ.



10

These atheists sound mighty contentious ... sheesh.
It's CHRISTMAS people. If you choose to celebrate it, dont' get upset when CHRIST is mentioned. Really ... like, if I go to a "solstice party" it'd be kind of foolish for me to complain about a lack of Christ there, wouldn't it? The whole reason for celebrating is different.
Why is it that Christians always have to bend and others can be stubborn in their own beliefs.

On another note, the "Pagan" christmas tree thing ... anyone here NOT put up a tree because of that? I do, but I have other Christian friends who won't.



11

How do I walk that line? First, I don't stop practicing my religion. I always attend mass and do various devotionals, and my family would find it disingenuous and insulting if I toned it down for their sakes.

Second, when Christmas season rolls around, I try to keep in mind just how alienating it is for my non-Christian friends (Jewish) and family (atheist)*. Self-identified Christians have said some really hurtful things to them. For example people often treat my atheist sister like she's some immoral, evil hedonist. She's a kind and loving person who volunteers at a women's shelter and hopes to become a social worker, but people have called her a "witch" and act like she's going to eat them. Meanwhile, my Jewish best friend quietly celebrates all of her important holidays (Passover, Roshashana, etc) without acknowledgement from her Christian acquaintances, but is a) treated like a freakshow with exotic traditions and b) expected to congratulate Christians left and right over their important holiday. For some reason, these issues seem to become exacerbated by the Christmas season and it's not uncommon for me to get a phone call because of yet another jerk treating them horribly for not being Christians. Whatever my struggles as a Christian, they don't begin to compare to the alienation and persecution that they have faced. So, I listen to them sympathetically and if they complain about Christians or Christmas, I try to keep in mind that they are venting about their ill-treatment and I don't take it personally. Because I am there for them and supportive of their own religious struggles, they are very happy to be there for me on Christmas and often join me in various religious celebrations.

*I'm excluding the Mormon family in this, because they rock CHRISTmas hard.



12

Move VERY far away so that it's impossible to get together?

The major conflict in my family came before I was born--my parents really had to take a stand when they wanted their wedding to be a Christ-honoring event. Their family gave them a really hard time, but they've been very respectful since. I think we've been the "odd" relatives--Christian school, Christian colleges, different values system--but as my aunts and uncles and cousins have grown and my parents remained consistently faithful, we've all become quite comfortable. I find it interesting that we hold such similar values now, and we can talk freely and disagree carefully and still love each other at the end of the day. And then go back, far, far way to where we live :) Facebook has helped us stay close.

I enjoy (most of the time) the television show Bones. The main character is a scientist and very logical (so, of course, she must be an athiest!); last night's episode she hosted a Christmas dinner, and when someone suggested saying a prayer over dinner, she said, VERY quickly, "No! Not in my house!" Found that quite interesting.



13

"Christ" has been pretty neatly excised from the American Christmas experience anyway. Which isn't too bad if you consider that His coming was really only a prerequisite for His death, and other than a silly bunny Easter hasn't become all that commercialized.

Incidentally, the celebration of Christmas in our culture is really a fairly recent innovation traceable back to, yes, Charles Dickens and that marvelous little book of his. (I don't care if you've seen all 20 movies, read the book!)

Prior to that, Christmas still labored under the edict of Lord Protector Cromwell who wasn't too keen on gaiety. (He probably smiled rather less than Mister Spock.) Yes, the Germans continued with their tradition but it was Dickens who did most to popularize the German Christmas tree in Great Britain and the U.S.

And speaking of the Germans, while they've gone too commercial as well nobody does Christmas like they do. Their Christmas markets full of ornaments, gifts, sausages, mulled wine, and other goodies are still underappreciated outside the Germanic world.

Germans actually celebrate Christmas Eve (birth night) and have no fewer than six entities that can bring presents (or sticks for bad kids), one of which is female and the other of which is usually female. The latter is Das Christkind, which translates into "Christ child" but is represented not by a baby but usually by a young blonde girl with angel wings.

If you're thinking of going to Germany or Austria, figure that the weather is probably going to be bad anyway and go in December!



14

#7 Emily wrote
"If I even try to voice an opinion, I usually get shot down by about 4 people. It's rough. If anyone has any advice for what to do in a family like mine, I would appreciate the advice."

I have had to deal with this most of my saved life (I was saved just before turning 21). Funny how you can live like the devil but if you start going to church to much, give up alcohol, and all of that, people are "worried" about you...:P

I think what you are doing already is the best thing. In Proverbs it says to flee the presence of a foolish man...and when people are not civilly debating but resorting to bashing, and rude behavior, and vulgarities, I get up and leave as politely as I can, while having a good attitude.

Now that I have children I do this for them as much as for me. I have (tried to) be polite, respectful, loving, and so forth, but also firm, saying something like, "I love you, but if you aren't going to be civil, we aren't going to be staying..." and then we leave. In my family, there used to be much drunkenness, but now they have all gotten the message, and there's only a small handful of family members we haven't seen in a while. They were given a choice between being sober while with us (with no vulgar or racist language) or not seeing their grandchildren.

I hated to do it, but I also hated growing up with boozers at the holidays, and I didn't want my children experiencing that part of the family legacy on what should be a happy time of year. We as a family usually have single moms over or some other family or individual in need over for Christmas instead.



15

Unrelated to family, but an old co-worker who is on my facebook recently posted on his status about how Christmas is not about Christ, since the Winter Solstice festivals were around LONG before Christ, so and that is what he celebrates, not Jesus.

A bunch of people got offended, and I was a lil'miffed, but at the same time, it is interesting to look at it from that perspective.



16

BI writes (#5):

Good article. If you want your loved ones to come to faith, you have to always and all the time testify about Jesus Christi without wavering and use every opportunity.

Not to be a pessimist about it, but if you do this, you're going to drive people away. Here's a typical conversation that may result:

Family member (FM): Uncle Bob is having Christmas dinner at his house this year.
Spouse of FM (S): Is BI going to be there?
FM: Probably.
S: Oh, good. We get to get preached at again, just like at Easter, the 4th of July party, little Bobby's birthday, Aunt Suzie's funeral, Thanksgiving, and the family reunion.
FM: How about we just do Christmas at home this year?
S: Works for me!



17

In response to Emily (#7) I can tell you that sometimes walking out IS the best thing to do. But not always.

Sometimes we really need to stand up for our own beliefs and feelings, and let our "loved ones" know just how much they are hurting us by their words and actions. If they truly love you (as you love them) then they would care more about hurting you. And if they don't, then I would reconsider the "necessity" of spending holidays with them. There were times when I literally had to remove myself from the family holiday celebration, due to the volatility. No point in making myself and everyone else miserable with the arguing, as it definitely wasn't displaying Christ's character in me.

Sometimes, however, gentle confrontation is the key. I have had to do this with my own sister on more than one occasion. While she was bashing Christians and others who she considered equally narrow-minded , she failed to see how narrow and biased her own viewpoints were. When the heated discussions died down and I pointed this out to her privately, she got quiet. I don't know if she agreed, but it definitely made her think. Since then she's been less aggressive in her anti-Christian rhetoric around me.

However, at times when nothing will change the verbal attacks...just remember that it's not the person that is opposing us, but rather the evil that lives in them that is causing all the trouble (Eph. 6:12). See the battle for what it is, put on God's armor, and love them enough to pray for them...even if from a distance.



18

I agree with V.V (#10)

How can someone come to a home that is celebrating CHRISTMAS and then be upset that CHRIST is discussed?

I just think it's all about respect. Just because we don't have the same beliefs doesn't mean we can't be cordial and respect each other. If they (or myself if I was in their home) don't like what's going on, they can leave.



19

My brother claims to be athiest (but by definition is more of an agnostic). He doesn't believe in God (or as he puts it, adults who still talk to their imaginary friends). He does, however, have incredible respect for our family's beliefs as a whole and will sit quietly while we pray or read the Christmas story. We pray for him and love him despite his rejection of Christ...but we don't push him away by preaching at him and threats of hell.

He was raised in a Christian home and he knows the Bible better than most Christians do. He simply doesn't believe it. This hurts both me and my parents, but we keep praying for his salvation.

I guess I can see how some people would have absolute disgust for some things Christmas, much in the same way I have absolute disgust for most things Halloween.



20

Emily (7) - perhaps even if you don't try to counteract their arguments, just remind them that their conversation might be offensive to other people at the table. Depending what they're like (eg. whether they're loving or whether they don't care) this might remind them to keep the Christian-bashing away from the dinner table. And then you can take the debates somewhere other than Christmas dinner :)

Zusanne - I think there's much more to suggest Bones is an atheist apart from the fact she's a scientist and logical. There are other characters in the show who are scientists and logical, but who (while there's nothing to suggest they ARE Christians, or some other religion) it is much easier to believe COULD have some sort of faith. (In fact there's one character who's explicitly Muslim).



21

Zusanne, #12:

I saw that episode of Bones as well--and the part you mentioned. But you know, that's the thing I like about that show is that it's very balanced--I mean, she is pretty rude to religious people regularly on the show, but you always see that she's being rude and overreacting because her partner balances her out. I find it very honest in that way.



22

Chris, 16

Тhis can happen with everyone, regardless of one’s personal faith. People can sneer at you behind your back and gossip about you and look at you condescendingly due to their own opinions and prejudices. People can judge you on the basis of their first impressions about you and of what they assume they know about you now and people can be very extreme and harsh in their judgments. They might not even consider what you might become, learn, or how you may develop as a person or the knowledge that you might possess and acquire one day.

Actually, this kind of behavior happened with me before and after I became a Christian and usually had nothing to do with my faith. Of course, come people would think I am stupid or I am so and so because I was a Christian, but I am more afraid of the other cases. For instance, some people would consider me stupid because I was no as good as they were in a specific set of skills. Hence, they sometimes would completely ignore my skills and knowledge in other areas and my character and abilities overall. They would treat me derogatorily and condescendingly just because at a certain point in time I was not that good in a specific set of skills without even considering for a moment that I might learn and with lots of hard work develop this kind of skills. However, most people are so superficial that they base their judgments on people on their first impressions and they do not think that people can change and grow in their talents and abilities.

Another example of my personal encounter with prejudice includes a conflict with a person in high position. He wanted for some reason to throw me out and obstruct the continuation of my graduate studies. However, after he made the decision to throw me out, I still continued working even harder during the rest of my studies. The reason why I did this was because I really wanted to learn and I was extremely passionate about some of the courses that I took. However, this looked bad for the reputation of the person who had decided to throw me out. So, he hated me immensely because of it and perhaps he even thought I was doing all this just because of him and in order to harm him in some way, which would be really stupid as I was only doing what I was doing before – studying and working hard on what I liked best at the time. Thus, just because of my continual hard work this person really hated me and he showed it clearly when he tried to persecute me even though he was the one who actually cheated and lied to me at the first place. Besides, he claimed to be a Christian. Nevertheless, there is nothing one can do to fight against stupid prejudices of people who don’t know you at all while assuming they know you and your motives well.


If a person is a genuine believer, it does not make any sense for unbelievers to avoid someone who will genuinely love them and be willing even to give up his own life for them. It does not make much sense to throw away the only true friend that one can actually have in this life, the only one who will never betray him or stab him in the back out of selfish gain, does it? But people usually do not have much sense, do they?



23

I know people (family etc.) who believe God exist but He has nothing to do with their daily lives. It is really hard for me to live with my parents (I'm in my late 30s and still live in my high school bedroom because I can't afford to live anywhere else....I don't pay rent but for the most part I do take care of myself except for the fact that I have been looking for a job over a year now & only have 16 weeks of unemoplyment money left)....My parents and I clash because of my beliefs and values.



24

To comment 22: Sarah Palin knows about being attacked because of her beliefs and values. I don't think I could handle being a Christian in the limelight. I admire the way Kurt Warner handles it....I sure hope Tim Tebow can handle it when he starts playing in the NFL.


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When the Christless Come Home for Christmas
by Matt Kaufman on 12/10/2009 at 8:30 PM

What's an atheist to do at Christmas? That's the topic of an Associated Press story on the subject. "Food, we like. Presents, we like. Seeing family, we like," says one. But, of course, that's not what Christmas is all about, and some chafe at the abundance of explicitly Christian activities and expressions. (Grumbles one, about his Christian mother: She "believes all that c__p.")

I'm not sure the people in this story are typical atheists, if there is such a thing. Most seem to be members of an atheist group (presumably that's how the reporter found them) who observe things like "Winter Solstice" activities. But there's a much larger number of less hardcore unbelievers, as many of us know firsthand: They're in our families. For us, the question is: What do we do when they come home for Christmas?

That can be a hard question to answer: Each case is so different, tangled up in individual family-relationship dynamics. All we can do here is to think about some general guidelines and try to apply them to our own families.

We don't want to promote family tensions and conflicts. We also don't want to turn Christmas into a lowest-common-denominator event where Christ is treated as an optional accessory. We'd like to find ways to witness. But we can't browbeat loved ones into faith and we shouldn't try. And we mustn't hide our faith to avoid discomfort either.

For those of you with non-Christians in the family: How do you walk that line? And (optional bonus question) do you think you've been taking the right approach, or have you gotten off track sometimes?

Hat tip to my friend Mollie Ziegler Hemingway, who put me onto this story.

Comments

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1

Christmas is interesting to say the least on my father's side of the family. Growing up my grandparents were "christian" in that they were "good" people. My aunt disavowed any religion. As children we were pretty outspoken about the real reason for Christmas. It got trickier as we grew-up. Then my aunt converted to Judaism and started celebrating Hanukkah.
If anything Jesus related comes up we answer frankly but don't dwell on it or cause it to become an argument.



2

One family tradition we have is reading Luke 2:1-20 before opening presents. It started with Grandpa, and has been rotated through all the grandkids and, now, great-grandkids. It's always been that way, so the non-Christians go along with it.

Though, for those without an older generation providing leadership, I suggest hosting the family gathering. Yes, this requires buying a bigger house. But then you can decorate that house with a Nativity Scene and other specifically Christian decorations. And, for those who want to de-emphasize Santa, decorate accordingly. It's quite easy for the children of non-Christian relatives to be curious about something like a Nativity Scene. They'll probably be perceptive enough to notice Santa missing, too.

One of my neighbors is on the corner lot. He always decorates for Christmas, as do I. But coming home one night this week, I was struck by how prominently his Nativity-Scene cutout sits on the corner of the lawn as we turn down the street. No reindeer or santas in his yard, either.



3

I think frankness and honesty (and good humor :o) are the most useful tools when you're getting together with people who don't believe as you do. I think you've just got to focus on your own celebration... If a family member who doesn't believe in God sees that you really do believe, and that you are having an authentic experience of worship or joy, it's harder for them to be cynical, and they will be more likely to respect your beliefs because they see them for what they really are instead of as an abstract concept.

I think that simply being authentically involved in the experience of God is the best testimony you can give.



4

I start out the day with prayer usually.

It's sometimes so easy for non-believers to be caught up in the Christmas Commotion of the Kitchen.

My idea is that we approach the day prayerfully and ask God to give us wisdom to live out the message even after the Lunch is done.



5

Good article. If you want your loved ones to come to faith, you have to always and all the time testify about Jesus Christi without wavering and use every opportunity. And it will hurt, it will hurt deeply when they reject you, when they sneer at you, when they gossip about you and when they attack you openly or behind your back. But if you want to succeed and your loved ones in your family to believe, you have to hold on and persist while continuing to show them that you love them and genuinely care for them. All people have many prejudices and many misconceptions about God, many bad experiences with other religious people, many misunderstandings due to bad theology, so one needs to overcome all these in order to properly communicate the message of the gospel. And make no mistake, this takes lots of effort, and requires persistence and lots of patience and steadfastness. That’s why it can be done only for people that you really love as it may cause you so much pain and hurt. However, the rewards may outweigh the temporary pain and troubles. But, please prepare yourselves well for your battles with good testimony and always treat others with great gentleness without pushing them to make an immediate decision on Jesus now (trust me the other way around is not good at all), and know that after all, everyone has a free choice and you cannot force them to accept Jesus – even with your best arguments and great love and testimony they can still reject God.



6

My sister converted to Jehovah's Witnesses, so she no longer celebrates holidays. She just had her first baby and it is going to be heartbreaking not to have them around the tree on Christmas morning. My family and I have faith and hope in the Lord that she will be convicted again someday by the true Word that was written on her heart in her youth.
Christmas is not a time for a family battle. It is a time to pray even more for our unbelieving relatives. It is an opportunity for us to reflect our Savior in our celebrations, our interactions, and our love.



7

I honestly don't know how to deal with it. My family is for them most part "Christian" (in that they believe that Jesus is messiah, but it doesn't really affect their day-to-day lives at all), and some of my cousins are outright atheists.

This is probably a terrible way to deal with it, but I generally just try to stay quiet and avoid arguments. Table conversation almost always turns into something vulgar/Christian bashing. When that happens I usually just get up and leave. They have the right to talk about whatever they want, but I don't have to participate.

If I even try to voice an opinion, I usually get shot down by about 4 people. It's rough. If anyone has any advice for what to do in a family like mine, I would appreciate the advice.



8

speaking as someone who no longer believes:

i go to mass on christmas with my family, more to keep everyone happy and spend time with my loved ones. other than that, everyone is pretty cordial about the religious belief issue. even my grandmother (who has reached the age where she no longer cares what anyone thinks about what she says)keeps the questions to a minimum.



9

My mom is Jewish, along with all of that side of the family and my dad was rasied Catholic, along with all of his side of the family. As you can imagine, this can lead to an interesting dynamic. In the Lord's sovereignty and amazing grace, He chose for me and my 3 siblings to come to a saving knowledge of Him as teenagers. I have made many, many mistakes through the years--most with good inentions--when it comes to witnessing to my family. What I have learned is that prayer is the most important factor. I have to pray over my family memebers, my time with them, and over myself. Satan seems to enjoy attacking me when there might be opportuniteis to witness Christ's love to my family. I've also learned that living my life for Christ and showing my family what His love looks like through my actions and love for them is sometimes more powerful than speaking it to them. Don't get me wrong, there are def. times when speaking Truth and the Gospel are necessary, also. Praying for opportunities, then for the boldness to act on those opportunities, then for the words to speak is so, so important. Lord willing there will be a day where my parents (and other family members) will be rejoicing in their salvation with me, but until that day i will continue to pray for their salvation and live my life intentionally and purposefully for Christ.



10

These atheists sound mighty contentious ... sheesh.
It's CHRISTMAS people. If you choose to celebrate it, dont' get upset when CHRIST is mentioned. Really ... like, if I go to a "solstice party" it'd be kind of foolish for me to complain about a lack of Christ there, wouldn't it? The whole reason for celebrating is different.
Why is it that Christians always have to bend and others can be stubborn in their own beliefs.

On another note, the "Pagan" christmas tree thing ... anyone here NOT put up a tree because of that? I do, but I have other Christian friends who won't.



11

How do I walk that line? First, I don't stop practicing my religion. I always attend mass and do various devotionals, and my family would find it disingenuous and insulting if I toned it down for their sakes.

Second, when Christmas season rolls around, I try to keep in mind just how alienating it is for my non-Christian friends (Jewish) and family (atheist)*. Self-identified Christians have said some really hurtful things to them. For example people often treat my atheist sister like she's some immoral, evil hedonist. She's a kind and loving person who volunteers at a women's shelter and hopes to become a social worker, but people have called her a "witch" and act like she's going to eat them. Meanwhile, my Jewish best friend quietly celebrates all of her important holidays (Passover, Roshashana, etc) without acknowledgement from her Christian acquaintances, but is a) treated like a freakshow with exotic traditions and b) expected to congratulate Christians left and right over their important holiday. For some reason, these issues seem to become exacerbated by the Christmas season and it's not uncommon for me to get a phone call because of yet another jerk treating them horribly for not being Christians. Whatever my struggles as a Christian, they don't begin to compare to the alienation and persecution that they have faced. So, I listen to them sympathetically and if they complain about Christians or Christmas, I try to keep in mind that they are venting about their ill-treatment and I don't take it personally. Because I am there for them and supportive of their own religious struggles, they are very happy to be there for me on Christmas and often join me in various religious celebrations.

*I'm excluding the Mormon family in this, because they rock CHRISTmas hard.



12

Move VERY far away so that it's impossible to get together?

The major conflict in my family came before I was born--my parents really had to take a stand when they wanted their wedding to be a Christ-honoring event. Their family gave them a really hard time, but they've been very respectful since. I think we've been the "odd" relatives--Christian school, Christian colleges, different values system--but as my aunts and uncles and cousins have grown and my parents remained consistently faithful, we've all become quite comfortable. I find it interesting that we hold such similar values now, and we can talk freely and disagree carefully and still love each other at the end of the day. And then go back, far, far way to where we live :) Facebook has helped us stay close.

I enjoy (most of the time) the television show Bones. The main character is a scientist and very logical (so, of course, she must be an athiest!); last night's episode she hosted a Christmas dinner, and when someone suggested saying a prayer over dinner, she said, VERY quickly, "No! Not in my house!" Found that quite interesting.



13

"Christ" has been pretty neatly excised from the American Christmas experience anyway. Which isn't too bad if you consider that His coming was really only a prerequisite for His death, and other than a silly bunny Easter hasn't become all that commercialized.

Incidentally, the celebration of Christmas in our culture is really a fairly recent innovation traceable back to, yes, Charles Dickens and that marvelous little book of his. (I don't care if you've seen all 20 movies, read the book!)

Prior to that, Christmas still labored under the edict of Lord Protector Cromwell who wasn't too keen on gaiety. (He probably smiled rather less than Mister Spock.) Yes, the Germans continued with their tradition but it was Dickens who did most to popularize the German Christmas tree in Great Britain and the U.S.

And speaking of the Germans, while they've gone too commercial as well nobody does Christmas like they do. Their Christmas markets full of ornaments, gifts, sausages, mulled wine, and other goodies are still underappreciated outside the Germanic world.

Germans actually celebrate Christmas Eve (birth night) and have no fewer than six entities that can bring presents (or sticks for bad kids), one of which is female and the other of which is usually female. The latter is Das Christkind, which translates into "Christ child" but is represented not by a baby but usually by a young blonde girl with angel wings.

If you're thinking of going to Germany or Austria, figure that the weather is probably going to be bad anyway and go in December!



14

#7 Emily wrote
"If I even try to voice an opinion, I usually get shot down by about 4 people. It's rough. If anyone has any advice for what to do in a family like mine, I would appreciate the advice."

I have had to deal with this most of my saved life (I was saved just before turning 21). Funny how you can live like the devil but if you start going to church to much, give up alcohol, and all of that, people are "worried" about you...:P

I think what you are doing already is the best thing. In Proverbs it says to flee the presence of a foolish man...and when people are not civilly debating but resorting to bashing, and rude behavior, and vulgarities, I get up and leave as politely as I can, while having a good attitude.

Now that I have children I do this for them as much as for me. I have (tried to) be polite, respectful, loving, and so forth, but also firm, saying something like, "I love you, but if you aren't going to be civil, we aren't going to be staying..." and then we leave. In my family, there used to be much drunkenness, but now they have all gotten the message, and there's only a small handful of family members we haven't seen in a while. They were given a choice between being sober while with us (with no vulgar or racist language) or not seeing their grandchildren.

I hated to do it, but I also hated growing up with boozers at the holidays, and I didn't want my children experiencing that part of the family legacy on what should be a happy time of year. We as a family usually have single moms over or some other family or individual in need over for Christmas instead.



15

Unrelated to family, but an old co-worker who is on my facebook recently posted on his status about how Christmas is not about Christ, since the Winter Solstice festivals were around LONG before Christ, so and that is what he celebrates, not Jesus.

A bunch of people got offended, and I was a lil'miffed, but at the same time, it is interesting to look at it from that perspective.



16

BI writes (#5):

Good article. If you want your loved ones to come to faith, you have to always and all the time testify about Jesus Christi without wavering and use every opportunity.

Not to be a pessimist about it, but if you do this, you're going to drive people away. Here's a typical conversation that may result:

Family member (FM): Uncle Bob is having Christmas dinner at his house this year.
Spouse of FM (S): Is BI going to be there?
FM: Probably.
S: Oh, good. We get to get preached at again, just like at Easter, the 4th of July party, little Bobby's birthday, Aunt Suzie's funeral, Thanksgiving, and the family reunion.
FM: How about we just do Christmas at home this year?
S: Works for me!



17

In response to Emily (#7) I can tell you that sometimes walking out IS the best thing to do. But not always.

Sometimes we really need to stand up for our own beliefs and feelings, and let our "loved ones" know just how much they are hurting us by their words and actions. If they truly love you (as you love them) then they would care more about hurting you. And if they don't, then I would reconsider the "necessity" of spending holidays with them. There were times when I literally had to remove myself from the family holiday celebration, due to the volatility. No point in making myself and everyone else miserable with the arguing, as it definitely wasn't displaying Christ's character in me.

Sometimes, however, gentle confrontation is the key. I have had to do this with my own sister on more than one occasion. While she was bashing Christians and others who she considered equally narrow-minded , she failed to see how narrow and biased her own viewpoints were. When the heated discussions died down and I pointed this out to her privately, she got quiet. I don't know if she agreed, but it definitely made her think. Since then she's been less aggressive in her anti-Christian rhetoric around me.

However, at times when nothing will change the verbal attacks...just remember that it's not the person that is opposing us, but rather the evil that lives in them that is causing all the trouble (Eph. 6:12). See the battle for what it is, put on God's armor, and love them enough to pray for them...even if from a distance.



18

I agree with V.V (#10)

How can someone come to a home that is celebrating CHRISTMAS and then be upset that CHRIST is discussed?

I just think it's all about respect. Just because we don't have the same beliefs doesn't mean we can't be cordial and respect each other. If they (or myself if I was in their home) don't like what's going on, they can leave.



19

My brother claims to be athiest (but by definition is more of an agnostic). He doesn't believe in God (or as he puts it, adults who still talk to their imaginary friends). He does, however, have incredible respect for our family's beliefs as a whole and will sit quietly while we pray or read the Christmas story. We pray for him and love him despite his rejection of Christ...but we don't push him away by preaching at him and threats of hell.

He was raised in a Christian home and he knows the Bible better than most Christians do. He simply doesn't believe it. This hurts both me and my parents, but we keep praying for his salvation.

I guess I can see how some people would have absolute disgust for some things Christmas, much in the same way I have absolute disgust for most things Halloween.



20

Emily (7) - perhaps even if you don't try to counteract their arguments, just remind them that their conversation might be offensive to other people at the table. Depending what they're like (eg. whether they're loving or whether they don't care) this might remind them to keep the Christian-bashing away from the dinner table. And then you can take the debates somewhere other than Christmas dinner :)

Zusanne - I think there's much more to suggest Bones is an atheist apart from the fact she's a scientist and logical. There are other characters in the show who are scientists and logical, but who (while there's nothing to suggest they ARE Christians, or some other religion) it is much easier to believe COULD have some sort of faith. (In fact there's one character who's explicitly Muslim).



21

Zusanne, #12:

I saw that episode of Bones as well--and the part you mentioned. But you know, that's the thing I like about that show is that it's very balanced--I mean, she is pretty rude to religious people regularly on the show, but you always see that she's being rude and overreacting because her partner balances her out. I find it very honest in that way.



22

Chris, 16

Тhis can happen with everyone, regardless of one’s personal faith. People can sneer at you behind your back and gossip about you and look at you condescendingly due to their own opinions and prejudices. People can judge you on the basis of their first impressions about you and of what they assume they know about you now and people can be very extreme and harsh in their judgments. They might not even consider what you might become, learn, or how you may develop as a person or the knowledge that you might possess and acquire one day.

Actually, this kind of behavior happened with me before and after I became a Christian and usually had nothing to do with my faith. Of course, come people would think I am stupid or I am so and so because I was a Christian, but I am more afraid of the other cases. For instance, some people would consider me stupid because I was no as good as they were in a specific set of skills. Hence, they sometimes would completely ignore my skills and knowledge in other areas and my character and abilities overall. They would treat me derogatorily and condescendingly just because at a certain point in time I was not that good in a specific set of skills without even considering for a moment that I might learn and with lots of hard work develop this kind of skills. However, most people are so superficial that they base their judgments on people on their first impressions and they do not think that people can change and grow in their talents and abilities.

Another example of my personal encounter with prejudice includes a conflict with a person in high position. He wanted for some reason to throw me out and obstruct the continuation of my graduate studies. However, after he made the decision to throw me out, I still continued working even harder during the rest of my studies. The reason why I did this was because I really wanted to learn and I was extremely passionate about some of the courses that I took. However, this looked bad for the reputation of the person who had decided to throw me out. So, he hated me immensely because of it and perhaps he even thought I was doing all this just because of him and in order to harm him in some way, which would be really stupid as I was only doing what I was doing before – studying and working hard on what I liked best at the time. Thus, just because of my continual hard work this person really hated me and he showed it clearly when he tried to persecute me even though he was the one who actually cheated and lied to me at the first place. Besides, he claimed to be a Christian. Nevertheless, there is nothing one can do to fight against stupid prejudices of people who don’t know you at all while assuming they know you and your motives well.


If a person is a genuine believer, it does not make any sense for unbelievers to avoid someone who will genuinely love them and be willing even to give up his own life for them. It does not make much sense to throw away the only true friend that one can actually have in this life, the only one who will never betray him or stab him in the back out of selfish gain, does it? But people usually do not have much sense, do they?



23

I know people (family etc.) who believe God exist but He has nothing to do with their daily lives. It is really hard for me to live with my parents (I'm in my late 30s and still live in my high school bedroom because I can't afford to live anywhere else....I don't pay rent but for the most part I do take care of myself except for the fact that I have been looking for a job over a year now & only have 16 weeks of unemoplyment money left)....My parents and I clash because of my beliefs and values.



24

To comment 22: Sarah Palin knows about being attacked because of her beliefs and values. I don't think I could handle being a Christian in the limelight. I admire the way Kurt Warner handles it....I sure hope Tim Tebow can handle it when he starts playing in the NFL.



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