The Bachelor Syndrome: Too Ingrained to Change?
by Thomas Jeffries on 11/10/2009 at 3:31 PM
Relationships -- at least successful ones -- are full of give and take, adaptability and compromise. Most of us have heard jokes about leaving the seat up or whether the toilet paper should roll "over" or "under," but sometimes those annoying little habits can turn into romantic dealbreakers when one or both parties refuses to change even a little bit.
I remember several years ago having a conversation with a single coworker about the available bachelors we both knew. She was in her mid- to late-20s at the time, and I mentioned a never-married guy who was probably pushing 40. While this young woman was eager to meet that special someone, she still seemed hesitant. Pressed further, she said it wasn't the age difference that concerned her, it was the fact that this man -- nice as he was -- had spent more than half his life as a single adult.
"Most men that age," she said, "are too set in their ways."
She wasn't opposed to dating somewhat older men, she said, but experience had taught her that many longtime bachelors have developed habits they are reluctant or even unwilling to alter. Simply put, when you've lived on your own for some 20 years, you're bound to settle into a routine or two or 27.
I've made sweeping generalizations before, so I'm not about to do so now. Besides, since I got married at 26, I'm not able to address this topic based on my own experience. So I'll ask you, dear Boundless readers -- do you agree with this sentiment? Do you think that singles, male or female, become more resistant to change as they get older?
Now, lest you think of this post as yet another depressing reminder from Boundless of how hard it is to find a spouse once you've passed age 40, I hereby give you hope: Remember that coworker who passed on dating the fortysomething guy? Well, that same man later met a single mom with two kids and is now very happily married.
Did he likely have to make a few compromises as he made the transition from bachelor to husband and father? No doubt he did, but isn't that what healthy relationships are all about?
1. Julie said the following at 4:09 PM on Nov 10:
It depends on the man, but thinking of some long-time single men I know, I wonder if they are just overly particular about who they will marry. So I would worry that they might hold a wife under a microscope. Depends on the man though, and the reason for his singleness. I think people are adaptable though--personally, I wouldn't worry about an older person being set in their ways.
2. DannieA said the following at 4:12 PM on Nov 10:
It would depend on the person. I dated a guy pushing forty while I was pushing 30 and yes I did find that this particular man was very set in his ways and it was going to be a 'his way or the highway' so we didn't end up moving further along in the relationship.
HOwever, I've found that some other men aren't that way and have married when the time came by (unfortunately not with me :P)
At this point in my early 30s, I'd be more apt to marry a single father because well...at least their issues are different, not so much that they don't want to take the plunge...if they have recovered and are good men, I could see them marrying again.
I know that opens up a whole other can of worms but those are my thoughts fwiw.
3. Tami said the following at 4:18 PM on Nov 10:
I concur with Julie. Many of the longtime bachelors I know are extremely picky and idealistic - there's always something "wrong" with each woman they know or meet.
Not that we should have to date or marry someone just because we're both single; we're not all matches -- but the pickiness is a pattern I've observed as well. (And of course there's something "wrong" with every woman! We're human too... by *definition* there's something wrong with each one of us!)
Also similar to Julie, I don't think that just because a guy is older, it necessarily follows that he's set in his ways. I wouldn't make that particular prejudgment. Because really, who knows why someone's older and still not married.
4. Jeremiah said the following at 4:19 PM on Nov 10:
This phenomenon certainly holds true for me. I’m 32 and have been living by myself (no roommates) for the last 7 years or so. I have always thought of myself as someone that enjoyed being around people and used to be very adaptable to change. In college, I lived in a fraternity house and had to learn to be very tolerant of other people’s messes, quirky habits, and occasional moodiness. It was the best time of my life!
Several years ago, I got into a relationship with a woman and was shocked at how much of that tolerance I had lost over the many years of singleness. In the back of my mind, I found myself being subtle annoyed when she did things differently – the way she loaded the dishwasher to the stuff she liked on TV. At first, dating was a treat. However, by the end, even carving time out of my schedule to drive to pick her up, or spending money out of my budget to pay for dates, or staying up "past my bedtime" (LOL), became a point of contention. In retrospect, I wish I had recognized how set in my ways I had become and worked to change that. 32 is too young to be prematurely old! :)
5. Andrew said the following at 4:23 PM on Nov 10:
We as a society do have the stereotype of the Confirmed Bachelor, or a man to set in his independent lifestyle to adapt to a marriage all that easily. I am 32, and sometimes i worry i may becoming too set in my ways the older i get. But i think for the right lady, i would bend over backwards. Marriage is alot about compromise, and as long as the man is still open to the realization of what being a husband means, i don't think it will be overly difficult.
I think we should all be cautious about starting a relationship with someone stuck in a rut, so to speak, whether male or female. The dating/engagement period is meant to be used to find these things out, so i think if we can just take it slow and see how things progress, we'll find the right one.
Just because it may be difficult doesn't mean it's not worth doing. Indeed, the more difficult things may be better in the end because of the struggle.
Always keep your eyes on God, and the rest will happen when it's meant to happen.
6. Sara said the following at 4:46 PM on Nov 10:
I think of the two older singles that I know best (one in her early forties, the other in his fifties), and both are very set in their ways. The woman would likely be willing to change a bit, but not completely. The man, on the other hand, has no desire to get married, and his main reason is based on the fact that he isn't ready to change at this stage in the game. He loves his life, he enjoys the freedom of being single, and he doesn't think the cons of adjusting to a relationship would outweigh the benefits.
7. Peter said the following at 5:01 PM on Nov 10:
I've long said that what I'm looking for, is a lass smart enough to make me *want* to change....
I'm a bit curious, tho. Why is it only men who are presumed to get set in their habits?
8. kris said the following at 5:03 PM on Nov 10:
While it is natural that as we grow older, we become more accustomed to doing things a certain way, change is always possible. And when we meet someone we want to enter into a relationship, we will learn to compromise, and hopefully learn not to sweat the small stuff. It might be hard, but it certainly will be worth it.
9. Kelly-1 said the following at 6:35 PM on Nov 10:
I love living alone so much.
However, God seems to conspire to ensure that these periods of living alone are only ever short term! He always brings about a major life change to ensure it lasts no longer than about 8 months.
Right now, I'm in the scenario where I FINALLY moved in properly to my own home and got a job in this city. Of course, my sister's family suddenly needed a place to live and all 5 of them have now moved in with me.
It's amazing how 'set in my ways' I become after 6 months of living alone. I freak out at every mark on the wall, I get SO annoyed every time something in the fridge is moved (and I can't find it), and the noise drives me INSANE. Not to mention the lack of a 'quiet space' to sit down and recharge, as all introverts need.
How do you deal with it? Having people move/rearrange/hide your stuff? Wasting half an hour looking for a pair of scissors that aren't in the drawer where they should be? Finding out that someone else ate that piece of pie you saved?
...I suspect the above paragraph describes most normal marriages. Help! ;)
10. emily said the following at 6:59 PM on Nov 10:
I am a single 30-something gal that desires marriage. Great! But I sometimes feel very set in my ways and sometimes think singleness is the easier route. Marriage seems scary to me at times. At least in my singleness, there is some predictability. But the price is loneliness. I've heard of people that got married later in life and their response was "Why did I wait so long?"
11. Elizabeth (from Canada) said the following at 7:10 PM on Nov 10:
Although I'm only in my late twenties I can already see myself settling into patterns and ruts. I have a tendency to dislike change and habits different from my own, but I see this tendency as being detrimental to living as a loving Christian, so I do my best to force myself into challenging situations where I'll need to be flexible and outside of my comfort zone. And I've made a decision never to live on my own (if at all possible), because I become way too selfish.
12. Susan H. said the following at 7:20 PM on Nov 10:
I do think that many single people become set in their ways, but it seems to me like we can avoid becoming this way if we're intentional about it. I'm twenty-six and I don't know for how long I'll be single, so I guard against rigidity by always living with a roommate or two. I don't ever plan to live alone--it would be too easy to forget my own quirks and annoying habits. :)
13. Amy said the following at 7:32 PM on Nov 10:
I think anyone (male or female) has the opportunity to become set in their ways. At 28, I've already considered this. I have roommates which helps to keep me flexible and conscious that it's not just about me, but I'm certainly getting used to taking care of myself and not having to check in with anyone. I do look forward to sharing my life with someone, but I think it will be a learning experience as we adjust to each other's ways AND to get used to "checking in" about our plans, money, etc. As a woman, I appreciate gestures from guys when they take care of me, but sometimes I don't even think about accepting them since I'm used to "doing it myself". Example, I was carrying an awkward package the other day and when a male friend offered to help, I said that I had it. Ummmm, hello? He was offering to help and I would have actually appreciated it. It took me a moment to realize that it was okay to accept his help because usually I haul my own stuff around. As a woman, I think that will be the hardest part as my singleness continues. Gestures of help or caring are actually a huge love language for me, but I've gotten so used to not receiving it that it will take some time for me to recognize it and accept it when the time comes. But don't you worry; once I realize it, I will be more than happy to accept such help. Someone to replace my windshield wipers...now that's romantic! :)
14. Nick said the following at 7:49 PM on Nov 10:
I would think this is a case-by-case issue.
For instance, a man and woman whom I know well - both in their early 30s - recently married. I considered both fairly set in their ways, each stubborn regarding certain things. I observed a lot of sparks fly as they struggled to adjust to each other both during their courtship and also throughout their first year of marriage.
However, the incredible love and respect each had for the other allowed them to make the necessary adjustments and compromises. Today I believe they are both quite different people in many ways than they were several years ago. I feel like today they are quite unified as a couple.
As for my own case... I'm 26, single, and live by myself so can't comment on long term bachelorhood tendencies.
15. farmer Tom said the following at 7:52 PM on Nov 10:
Thomas,
Remember that coworker who passed on dating the fortysomething guy? Well, that same man later met a single mom with two kids and is now very happily married.
I have a fresh package of T-bone steak, which we just got from the locker last week, which I put up as my side of the following bet.
I bet that the single female who rejected the fortysomething guy...................
is still unmarried.
My experience has been that women who complain about men who are unable to change are usually the ones who want control in a relationship and in fact are looking for excuses not to ever commit to a marriage relationship in which they would have to submit to the leadership of the man.
I once pursued a very attractive young lady who was everything I was looking for in a potential mate. She had every excuse in the book why she would not date me. And she certainly has that right, God gave her a free will. But, 20 years later she is now 43 and unmarried. I on the other hand moved on, found a lovely wife and now have four beautiful children. Funny how she believed that she could do better than me, and wound up with nothing. Of course maybe nothing is better than me, but.............
16. BDB said the following at 7:58 PM on Nov 10:
Volunteering in Children's ministry will cure you of that. A new craft every week!
Seriously though as **cough** the oldest one here, prayer works for all things. God is fully capable of flipping someone's life upside down to break them out of their ruts. I guess that would be shaking them out of their ruts.
For example, I have a house guest for a week. A relative who's working with a drag-racing team decided to come to the local raceway. And I have a guest room. I thought it was for 3 days, turned out to be a week. The good news is that we're both pretty laid back. But...I had about two days' notice and that's a quick adjustment!
Of course, I also had some friends in college who...shall we say...didn't plan very far ahead. I realized for my own sanity that the best thing to do when spending time with them was a) Make sure I had at least $40 in cash, b) A full gas tank and c) block out six hours.
I never had any idea what would end up happening. But by creating large margins I kept my expectations in a place where it didn't matter what they randomly decided to do. I was prepared to roll with it.
Women of a certain age become just as set in their ways...
17. Rachael said the following at 8:12 PM on Nov 10:
I wonder if it is more an issue of the kinds of habits and/or perhaps degree of ingrainedness...but I suppose young people as well as older people can come into marriage with bachelor/bachelorette habits.
18. Vanessa said the following at 8:20 PM on Nov 10:
I'm female, 30 and single. I've lived alone for 4 years and with roommates for 5 years...and while I don't think I'll have trouble adapting to a spouse, I'm not the best with roommates. Most of my roommates have agreed with me that I'm better off living alone.
My main issues with roommates stem from having separate lives under one roof. I get most annoyed at having meal preparation interrupted and having to fight for solitary bathroom time or use of laundry facilities. I don't anticipate my husband demanding to fix his own dinner while I'm in the middle of preparing food...or fighting me for use of the washing machine!
Also, I was taught to keep a clean house (although not necessarily "neat") and I tend to end up with roommates who won't wipe crumbs from the countertops (which draw roaches and ants) BUT who positively freak out at the thought of a newspaper being left anywhere other than the recycle bin (which does not draw roaches or ants). Sigh.
Bring on the husband! LOL.
19. Rachael Starke said the following at 9:20 PM on Nov 10:
When I was 26, I was introduced by email to a man by mutual friends. It wasn't until a month or so into the friendship, where we'd progressed to almost nightly phone calls, that I found out he'd just turned 40. (The friends that set us up weren't sure how old he was, and decided to round down. :) ) I'll admit that the discovery wasn't exactly welcome at first. To make a long story short, we long distance dated for seven months, and got married five months after that. And I'll admit I was terrified that we'd kill each other after both having lived on our own for so long. I was totally wrong - it was when we had kids that things got hard, and for more due to my immaturity than his stubbornness. There have been tradeoffs - different energy levels, he's had some health issues - but that's the case in every marriage. He's a mature, amazing man and my best friend. And I'm glad the reason he hadn't been married before we met was because he was waiting for me. :)
20. Craig M. said the following at 9:23 PM on Nov 10:
Why should I need to change perfection? ;)
21. a sassy sister said the following at 10:07 PM on Nov 10:
As I'm getting older, I realize that being set in my ways is not simply about being single, but about getting older and my choices regarding change. Frankly, I think the "bachelor" syndrome is really misidentified, because adjusting to change is not just about relationships with others....it's also a huge part of living. So I guess my problem isn't about adjusting to change, but the "single" box as it is framed.
Besides, I've seen plenty of married people who are stubborn and set in their ways, and I've seen older singles who are much more flexible and accommodating....Perhaps it's a question of character,personality,and experiences, not marital status...
22. Stefanie said the following at 10:18 PM on Nov 10:
I think people in general get set in their ways as they get older - single or married.
My mom just recently started renting a room in her house to a woman from her church. My mom has complained to me about many things her new tenant does, such as leave the windows open when she leaves the house.
The only reason you notice it more with single people is that they are not married yet. Married people have the luxury of getting set in their ways together, and they never have to open their house to other people ever again, so you - as an outsider - would never notice.
23. khalil said the following at 10:42 PM on Nov 10:
I've lived alone from 1995-2009, except for a year when I was in college, moving off campus with friends and then with other friends (in their basement)for six months before I moved abroad recently. Most, not all of my adult life has been living alone.
In my single living arrangement I can see that I've most definitely picked up some quirks. Though the year in college and recent months with friends were good experiences I prefer to live alone and can't imagine sharing a living space and all that goes with it. Where I am now I was quite fearful that I'd have to have a roommate but was surprised with a great apartment (too small for more than one person) and no apparent way to have a roomie.
I believe that getting set into my ways isn't an affect of being single or living alone, I think it is due to getting older. Living in another culture does cause one to be flexible and adapt, but I am more set in my ways now at 32 than I was at 22 when I graduated college, and even more so than when I completed my grad. work at age 27. And it happens to both genders equally.
24. Colin said the following at 10:47 PM on Nov 10:
I'm 23, single, and have never had any roommates. I came to law school straight from undergrad so my routine of school and then homework really hasn't changed that much from high school.
Then again, I'm still young and am working to get more involved to the extent I can.
25. Mark said the following at 11:10 PM on Nov 10:
In the world of psychology, they call this "crystallization." Simply put, behaviors which are reinforced (or not challenged) become more ingrained over time. It happens to everyone.
In many ways, crystallization can be a good thing. Consider how long it takes you to tie your shoes or write your name now compared to when you were 4 or 5 years old. Practice makes perfect, or so they say.
When you do the same thing over and over and get the same result, you eventually just stop evaluating it. Why bother? The behavior becomes a habit, a collection of such habits define the boundaries of our comfort zone, and stubborn adherence to that comfort zone is an expression of pride in our own "wisdom."
Perhaps Jesus' admonition to have child-like faith could be seen in this light, to carefully consider everything we do and cultivate a willingness to change our ways.
26. Callie said the following at 11:17 PM on Nov 10:
First of all, I think we have to consider that our relationship with Jesus is a great deal about us being conformed to His likeness. If this guy is a believer, he should have that willingness to change in his heart and mind already.
Next, she needs to confront the habits she's concerned about before writing him off. Sometimes when I watch popular sitcoms, I'm amazed by how quickly the characters will break up with someone over an issue that could really be worked through. Maybe this woman has adopted a few bad habits from pop culture, herself. Maybe she needs to change how she communicates in relationships.
If this guy said, "No this isn't something I'm willing to change." Then he has a problem, but if she's not giving him a chance to work through the concerning issues with her, then she has a problem.
Who's to say she's not the one set in her ways?
27. Melissa said the following at 3:02 AM on Nov 11:
By no means do I think this is a guys-only problem! I'm 32 and single and have a desire for marriage but am firmly set in my ways. In fact, Jeremiah (#4), I think we were separated at birth! I also stopped dating a guy because I was cranky from staying out too late and felt like he was taking up all my free time. And yes, we're far too young to be this old!
A couple of years ago I had a conversation with a guy in the same situation (pushing 30 and perpetually single), and we laughingly agreed that although we liked each other, we were just not interested in the "hassles" of pursuing a relationship.
Isn't that sad? I don't know when I got so old, but I swear, on Friday nights I'm so exhausted from the week (I teach high school), that going out is the absolute *last* thing I want to do. Still, like Emily (#10) said, the price is loneliness.
How do we reconcile the two? The need to be autonomous and the need for companionship?
28. Eddie Ssemakula said the following at 3:14 AM on Nov 11:
You reminded me of a statement i told my friend Martin when i visited him and entered his house without removing my shoes (It's culture down here in Africa to leave your shoes at the door when you visit).
I remember telling him "i will change when i get married"
Of course some habits ingrained from a sinful nature do stay.
But allow me say this without 'spiritualising' it that you wont find a "perfect-no-habit-man or woman" to marry.
We should be sticking to the things that matter most like the willingness to follow the Spirit's promptings to change.
Lol
29. twilley said the following at 3:23 AM on Nov 11:
I think it's absolutely true--I also think it gets harder to live with someone the more time you spend living on your own. Not that living on your own for a time isn't healthy, cuz I think it is.
But I was recently separated from my partner for only like six weeks--and re-adjusting again to living in the same apartment was a tough one!!
30. Amir Larijani said the following at 3:54 AM on Nov 11:
First of all, high-5 to Farmer Tom.
Secondly, looking at the scenario as told:
This does not look like a portrait of a man who is "inflexible" and "set in his ways", but rather of one who is quite sacrificial and willing to take on extraordinary burdens that he would otherwise be justified in not taking.
The woman in her mid-20s might be "justified" in her assessment--and no doubt she will find any number of friends who will agree with her.
Still, by extending cynicism--rather than grace--by not even giving him a chance, she only perpetuated her--and his--singleness. I would also submit that she missed out on a good catch.
I'm an older guy: I'll be 43 in January. Do I have areas where I am set in my ways? You bet. I get up early, work for a living, exercise daily (ok, maybe too much), and talk for nearly 2 hours on the phone every night with my 28-year-old fiancee, even reading the Bible with her over the phone. I also keep my house reasonably clean.
To Tami's credit, she at least gave the guy a fair chance--the gal in Jeffries' narrative did not.
As for "overly particular" (Julie), I've seen that go both ways. I've been turned down for every reason under the sun during my single life: I wasn't a pre-tribber, I wasn't tall enough, I wasn't "exciting" enough, I was too nerdy, I didn't make enough money.
Inflexibility is no respecter of either age or gender.
31. Zusanne said the following at 7:02 AM on Nov 11:
About ten years ago, I atteded a singles' group at another church. As a person in her mid-twenties, I was about 15 years younger than the next youngest person there. Most of the people in the group had been divorced but had been living alone for many years. And VERY set in their ways. One of my friends used to fill in as the class's teacher occasionally and made some rather disparaging remarks about them (it's obvious why most of them are still single and other compliments).
I left that group after about a year, but had made a dear friend from that group who was in her early fifties. I managed to shake her up a little :)
Now that it's ten years later . . . I find myself at times adopting her behaviors. It does make me nervous.
I have found, however, that most of my friends who have married when they're older appreciate more the companionship of their spouse than those who marry younger. It's been my observation that those who marry when they've lived alone for a period of time don't take for granted many of the things that those who married at a "more appropriate time" sometimes do.
32. obewan said the following at 7:16 AM on Nov 11:
And once again, Boundless is out to attack and "bash" the "character" of single men. Why is it that that must happen so often on this blog? Instead of a post-up with a declaration "...Bachelor..." why not for once give equal attention to women too? It could have been titled "...Singles..." to be fair. I have seen this problem affect both sexes for Pete's sake.
And I know many singles past age 30 who are single through no fault of their own and who are not overly "fussy". I also know of several examples where people married later in life and got along fine. A person can be “stubborn” at ANY age.
In my case, I have lived with roommates both fussy and messy and we got along fine. I am most particular about food, but am still flexible. If I was married and made chili I am sure there would be jalapenos and Tabasco in mine alone but not in hers. There are ways to compromise on most issues, so why get all negative and stressed about this issue. Common sense should prevail over negative thinking.
33. Bethany in Denver said the following at 8:33 AM on Nov 11:
I think men and women are equally likely to become set in their ways over time. I agree with many of the posts here that the biggest way to combat this is ROOMMATES!! Granted, marriage is way different than having a roommate. BUT, in the meantime, you are learning to deal with all the relatively small conflicts - toilet paper direction, towel folding, stuff in a different place than you prefer it, wakeup times, etc. So the ideal would be when you get married that you are dealing with and addressing the larger issues and root issues rather than who didn't make their clothes into the hamper.
34. Roomie said the following at 9:07 AM on Nov 11:
I worried about getting set in my ways and too used to being alone, so I decided to get roommates! (after living alone for 8 years) So far I've been living with one roomie for a month, and I am really enjoying it!! I think it's teaching me to be less selfish, plus it's just really nice to be able to talk to someone at home. I knew it might stretch me, but I think that's good.
Dennis Miller talks a little more about this in Blue Like Jazz, where his pastor encouraged him to move into a house with some other guys. Community is so important.
I really hope I don't have to live alone again! And I NEVER thought I'd be able to say that.
35. Lis said the following at 9:20 AM on Nov 11:
i am only 24, and the only time i have lived away from home is this year and last school year in the dorms. i think it may become harder the older people get, to want to change habits. i think part of it could be their personality, depending on if they are flexible or more independent and structured. it just comes down to making a choice to not let stupid things bug us and be willing to adjust.
i have not had that much time living alone yet, but in some ways i am fairly flexible. i am not the kind of person who will flip out if my future husband doesn't sort laundry the way i do (as long as he doesn't do something like bleach the colors) or fold towels a certain way. i don't really care.
it's funny, because i actually have a single room here at college; i really did NOT want a roommate, and i am very happy with that. i needed my space to focus and study, i'd go nuts if i was around a roommate all the time, even though my dorm has a small living room, bedroom, and private bathroom. i'm a very easygoing person, but i also love my peace and quiet. my sister asks me all the time if i don't want a roommate then how will i adjust to being married. i think it is different with someone i want to spend the rest of my life with, although i know we will still get on each other's nerves, versus being dropped with a complete stranger in a tiny space. i don't know.
36. Beth said the following at 10:16 AM on Nov 11:
My last roommate was a good bit older than me. She has the desire to get married, but some ingrained habits that will probably pose difficulty. Some of her habits affected me negatively, and I think they'd affect many potential husbands similarly, but I didn't know how to help her see that in a loving and encouraging way. This showed me my own need for growth.
37. NewName said the following at 10:17 AM on Nov 11:
Both a sassy sister (#21) and Stefanie (#22) are right. People, whether single or married, get set in their ways as they get older according to their personalites and values. Married people are just given a pass that singles are not. I certainly know married couples that have together become more selfish and unyielding towards others over the years.
38. Kit said the following at 11:44 AM on Nov 11:
I think so. My husband and I are both mid-twenties, but even then it was a hard adjustment, as we both lived on our own first. He's currently deployed, and I know it's going to be an adjustment when he gets back, too. IT's easy to get used to your way of doing things and not compromise with another person, and it can be quite a shock when you get married! That said, marriage is worth it. :-)
39. Bernie said the following at 11:49 AM on Nov 11:
I know teenagers, youngest children, and six year olds that refuse to change, too. I don't know if this character trait is just something that starts once a person is older. I think it's a lifestyle of submission to God and dying to self daily that helps people change for the better. People "set in their ways" won't die to self if their behavior bothers God or their spouse.
---
I like to shop at a grocery store where the food is usually more expensive but the lines are shorter, and my girlfriend likes to shop at a grocery store that I think is a madhouse, but the prices are somewhat cheaper. If we marry, I can either be wasteful with our money and go to the convenient store, or be frugal with our money and live through the inconvenience of the madhouse.
That's just a small example of how after talking it through, realizing that I should probably "change" and start getting use to Madhouse-Mart. =)
40. Alexandra said the following at 11:50 AM on Nov 11:
I'm 30 and have been single my entire life, due to circumstances too numerous and boring to list here. I live alone in a studio apartment and I am generally very happy (I have a wonderful church family surrounding me with whom I spend time with almost daily). I have a routine and I like to organize my time and things in a certain way, just like most people who live alone.
But, goodness, I'm not married to these things. I'd be quite happy to trade in my ability to have my sock drawer organized the way I like it for a husband.
Being "set in your ways" seems decidedly unbiblical. We are supposed to be "set in God's ways". In my opinion, if we're talking about two believers attempting to conform to the image of Christ, "too ingrained to change" ought to be a moot point. Both parties are trying to change every day. That's called sanctification. Isn't marriage designed by God to hasten that process by making us LESS ingrained in our own ways?
41. RLynn said the following at 12:14 PM on Nov 11:
I would agree that getting "set in one's ways" and other quirks can be attributed to age as well as whether one is married or single--it's just more obvious on single folks. I'm one of those folks who is 40+ and have lived alone for a while now--but I try to live intentionally and have lots of company and overnight guests. I've even had a family of 5 spend two weeks with me (we're still friends)! I have heard, however, that two single folks who get married later in life need to make special accomodations for each other--and give each other a little more space (like separate office/play space) in a home, than couples who married younger.
42. Melissa S. said the following at 12:28 PM on Nov 11:
Kelly #9- "How do you deal with it? Having people move/rearrange/hide your stuff? Wasting half an hour looking for a pair of scissors that aren't in the drawer where they should be? Finding out that someone else ate that piece of pie you saved?"
Welcome to life! lol! Some people are more polite and courteous than others but that's about what family life is like. I haven't moved out on my own (25 in two weeks) yet and so far can't really see a good reason for me to do so unless I get married. I love my family and we're all relatively normal so it's nice to still be at home. A big part of why I stay at home, though, is because of all the small annoyances and not being able to arrange my life in every detail just how I'd like it. I'm naturally selfish and I'm afraid I'd get worse if I lived by myself and had only myself to please.
I deal with it by praying for grace to become more selfless when my attitude is the problem, and by forgiving when the other person has offended me. Besides, I'm sure that I cause plenty of these annoyances to the rest of the family, too!:)
43. Rebekah in SoCal said the following at 12:59 PM on Nov 11:
I'm a 26 yr old female and am definately getting stuck in my ways. My dad always taught me to use my time well, you could even say "to spend it on the best things" . . . and I've had many years to build a sort of heirarchy of choices. Some of these are admittedly over-the-top, but it's there and future-unknown-to-me-husband and I will have some work to do.
It will also be hard for me to merge my budget with someone else if we have different spending/saving/investing priorities. I want to be married and am willing to do the work to adjust, but I know it will be very hard.
At least I'm good at adjusting to the different lifestyles and habits of my roommates. Actually, I've realized I NEED roommates to keep some flexibility in my life.
44. Julie said the following at 1:20 PM on Nov 11:
Amir said this: "As for "overly particular" (Julie), I've seen that go both ways. I've been turned down for every reason under the sun during my single life: I wasn't a pre-tribber, I wasn't tall enough, I wasn't "exciting" enough, I was too nerdy, I didn't make enough money."
Totally agree. Not a gender specific thing.
45. Zusanne said the following at 1:51 PM on Nov 11:
obewan (32) Although the story started with a man, here's the original question: "Do you think that singles, male or female, become more resistant to change as they get older?" Seems like equal opportunity.
You said, "common sense should prevail over negative thinking." I agree.
And, on an only marginally-related issue, I (and other of my female friends) like both Tabasco and jalepenos. Bring on the hot stuff!
46. Dante said the following at 2:12 PM on Nov 11:
"Being "set in your ways" seems decidedly unbiblical. We are supposed to be "set in God's ways". In my opinion, if we're talking about two believers attempting to conform to the image of Christ, "too ingrained to change" ought to be a moot point. Both parties are trying to change every day. That's called sanctification. Isn't marriage designed by God to hasten that process by making us LESS ingrained in our own ways?"
oooooh! I like you! You make an amazing point here. Being single for so long--I feel--disables your ability to adapt to change. This is partly why I feel that marrying early (what our culture deems early) is beneficial: the two parties build lives intertwined with each other, rather than two worlds colliding when both parties are settled into their ways of doing things after so many years.
I've had roommates in their thirties, and known of single women in their forties who are DEFINITELY glued into their way of doing things. I can imagine that it would be very tough to give those things up. When you're single and that much time passes, there's a great temptation for many people to become inwardly focused and somewhat selfish.
47. Vanessa said the following at 2:17 PM on Nov 11:
#42 - "Welcome to life?" To me...that sounds like someone who is either an extrovert, the baby of the family...or both. Anyone who is an introverted oldest child would have a HUGE fit about any of that because it is COMMON COURTESY!!!
If you have roommates, you don't go taking their food without asking permission. I once had a roommate eat an entire jar of peanut butter that I had purchased (all of us bought our own food and labeled it with our initials) because she was too "busy" to go buy her own. To me, that was completely inconsiderate...because not only did she not ask permission, she didn't say a word when I wondered aloud if I was going nuts because the peanut butter seemed to be going down faster than I was eating it. She didn't confess until she finished the jar, and then didn't even bother to offer to replace it when she had eaten at least 75% of the jar. At least if my husband had done that...it would have been "his" jar of peanut butter as well, and I would have just put it on the grocery list to buy more at the next trip to the supermarket.
I know that both marriage and having roommates both require compromise, but I have had more married people tell me that the compromise is different than that it is the same. The married people who tell me that living with a spouse and living with roommates is similar...are married people who are unhappy in their marriage for one reason or another and are more likely to be in divorce court than the ones who say that spouses and roommates are different.
Any happily married people concur?
48. Louise from Chicago said the following at 2:23 PM on Nov 11:
Comment 15, maybe the lady you were pursuing just didn't like you in a dating way.
Did you ever think of that?
Those situations are very common.
49. BDB said the following at 2:38 PM on Nov 11:
Rebekah in SoCal (#43) wrote:
>>It will also be hard for me to merge my budget with someone else if we have different spending/saving/investing priorities. I want to be married and am willing to do the work to adjust, but I know it will be very hard.<<
Nah, just cut and paste the cells from your spreadsheet into his and adjust the formulas. Not hard at all. :D
50. BDB said the following at 3:11 PM on Nov 11:
OK, here's a concept for y'all.
As the person who types of the prayer requests for my Bible study, I noticed that the successful married couples are pretty much constantly taking into consideration how their actions affect the other members of the family, and ask for prayer on how they respond to certain situations because of the effect on others.
I mentioned this observation to them, and they all nodded their heads and said, "Yes, of course, you have to do that."
The last two single women I shared this observation with told me flat out that I was wrong and that you shouldn't have to do that.
When I mention this to married people, they say, "Perhaps that's why they're still single."
So, you may notice older singles that are very set in their ways. But I submit for your consideration that they were once young singles set in their ways...and refused to adjust for anyone else. Do that for 20 years, and now they're older singles...
51. Pak said the following at 3:16 PM on Nov 11:
Comment 48: That's certainly a possibility but that should be the reason given if a reason was given at all. Just because those situations are very common doesn't mean that the lady (or gent) will admit it for fear of being the "bad guy". Don't look for attributes in the other party as a reason to turn them down. They may actually change something about themselves that makes them attractive to the next person.
52. FutureMrsLarijani said the following at 3:53 PM on Nov 11:
For the women that didn't think Amir was "exciting" . . .
apparently they never experienced his road rage. ;)
That is entertainment all it's own.
53. DannieA said the following at 4:06 PM on Nov 11:
I'm single....but to the people thinking that roommates will solve things to make you less selfish...oh HECK NO.
Roommates are for college. The next roommate I will have will be my husband thank you very much. Wanna know why?
Our accounts are the same, the stuff in our house belong to us....Not so with roommates. With roommates ONE always has to be the bearer of the name on bills....mortgage/renter agreement and what if your roommates don't pay up? evictions and small claims court and credit ruined....oh no no no no no.
I'll compromise when my HUSBAND and I are the same for bills, furniture, housing, and everything.
54. Charlie said the following at 4:07 PM on Nov 11:
Too old to change? Not true. I'm a single 48 year-old man, and just this year I sold my house, moved 3000 miles away and am serving God on the mission field. I plan to go to Cambodia, a country I've never visited, in about two months from now. It's been a real adventure!! I'm happier now than I've been in at least five years.
55. Carol said the following at 4:23 PM on Nov 11:
I moved in with my grandmother after living on my own for 2 1/2 years, and yes, I discovered that I liked doing things my own way. However, so does she (she has been widowed for over ten years).
Our compromise: We leave for church ten minutes early instead of twenty minutes early like she wants or 3 minutes early like I want. :)
I am somewhat set in my ways at 27, but I don't think I am too inflexible. After all, growing up in a large family taught me that everything and anything could happen at any time, and to always be prepared to drop my plans if something comes up.
56. BDB said the following at 4:56 PM on Nov 11:
Charlie (#54) - there are a number of single women in Cambodia as missionaries. I'm sure you'll meet them!
57. Tami said the following at 4:57 PM on Nov 11:
Go, Charlie (54)! That is awesome.
58. Melissa S. said the following at 5:00 PM on Nov 11:
Vanessa #47-"To me...that sounds like someone who is either an extrovert, the baby of the family...or both. Anyone who is an introverted oldest child would have a HUGE fit about any of that because it is COMMON COURTESY!!!"
Well, I'm an extroverted oldest child of eight, if you're curious. I guess my comment was more general than the exact specifics in the post I was replying to. I totally agree that it's common courtesy not to eat labeled food. We don't do that at our house. :)
I was trying to point out that living with annoying sinners is a basic fact of life for most people. Sure, if we're talking about diabolical roomates, you're going to have more stuff to deal with, but things not being put back where they go, your things getting rearrranged ocasionally, and food that you wanted to eat getting eaten (unless it's been labeled) is not mecessarily a sign of horrible impolite people, although, yes, it could be. There are lots of reasons why these things happen and it's pretty much life in any house or workplace.
Your other comment about spouses/compromises being different was interesting. I've heard that it's way easier living with a spouse than being an adult living at home with siblings/parents. I wouldn't know, but sometimes I think it has to be way easier being married and in your own house than being an adult in your parent's house. Our family gets along and thinks more alike than most families that I know but sometimes I just get sick of ______ (insert whatever) and want my own kitchen. So yeah, a spouse situation seems different than roomates, or even family.
59. FutureMrsLarijani said the following at 5:36 PM on Nov 11:
I will have to admit, my fiance is pretty set in his ways. However he has done the following:
(1) Carved out time in his daily schedule for me.
(2) Re-arranged priorities in order to spend time with me on a regular basis. Since we are 5 hours (one way drive) from each other. This isn't "easy".
(3) Is giving up his much-loved gym membership in order to make financial room for a wife.
These are just a few of the big changes the seemingly inflexible fiance has made.
I think there is merit to much of what many others are saying. If people aren't willing to be selfless they make terrible prospective covenant partners.
60. Thomas Jeffries said the following at 5:37 PM on Nov 11:
Farmer Tom (#15) said:
I bet that the single female who rejected the fortysomething guy ...................
is still unmarried.
Well, it did take her a while, but the young lady -- a pretty faithful Boundless reader, from what I could tell -- got married sometime last year. Though her husband is somewhat closer to her in age, I never asked if he was extremely set in his ways. (He is in the military, but I have no idea if that makes a difference.)
And obewan (#32), as Zusanne (#45) already noted, my question was, "Do you think that singles, male or female, become more resistant to change as they get older?" As a former single man myself, I have absolutely no desire to attack or bash their character.
61. a sassy sister said the following at 5:42 PM on Nov 11:
(sighs)....
to Dante:
Early marriages work when there is a real community of support for them, as well as two mature people who understand the gravity of commitment to the covenant, regardless of the other person's behavior. Such behavior is not instantly adapted, but rather learned over a period of time. Adjusting to change(and changing overall) is part of the process of sanctification; marriage is a vehicle, but the covenant itself is not a catalyst unless a person makes the DECISION to change, and continues to make decisions to move in that direction.
So, many commenters have noted that resistance and stubborness in change is not simply a gender specific thing; and frankly, neither is it an age or marital status thing. Perhaps it is a maturity/character issue(which, I submit is not limited to age, marital status, gender, economic standing, or even geographical location.
Mr. Jeffries, is this post intended to create discussion about protracted singleness for those who are older, or are you polling commenters to see if this sentiment can possibly provide an explanation for it?
62. Amir Larijani said the following at 6:38 PM on Nov 11:
FutureMrsLarijani says:
Gee, thanks honey. T minus 24 days...
:::switching into fake diplomacy mode:::
I was merely providing strenuous remarks regarding the inherent lack of ability of certain drivers to properly handle their vehicles so as to (a) stay on their side of the road, (b) not pass vehicles when they have double solid lines (and with a blind curve approaching), (c) not drive with high-beams on when other vehicles are approaching them, and (d) allow adequate separation when driving behind Mr. Larijani.
:::switching back to standard mode while attempting to maintain a straight face...:::
63. Kelly-1 said the following at 6:47 PM on Nov 11:
Stefanie:
"Married people have the luxury of getting set in their ways together, and they never have to open their house to other people ever again, so you - as an outsider - would never notice."
THANK YOU for this insight. Given that a married couple moved in with me, they keep insisting that 'their way' is right (because it's 2 versus 1). But I think I am perfectly justified in asking that the front door be kept locked all the time! (After all, it's my house!)
---
Vanessa: "Anyone who is an introverted oldest child would have a HUGE fit about any of that"
You described me perfectly. ;) But I do agree with Melissa S. that I need to be more graceful about it all. If only they would offer to pay rent...sigh.
I've had these new house "guests" for 4 months now. I can't take it much longer. I'm planning to move out... of my OWN house.
So a warning for you all: if family moves in, chances are, they'll never leave.
64. NYCgirly said the following at 7:21 PM on Nov 11:
I believe if we are seeking and following God none of us should be resistant to change. I personally have been forced by God to change in all kinds of ways.
Recently, I have taken my Mother in after my parents divorced and lost their home. Mind you I live in a studio apartment in NYC. This has been challenging. All this to say, God has made change inevitable. I certainly had to give up my ways in this situation.
Also, aside from my Mother, I won't welcome anyone else as a roomie except my husband. As DannieA said, roomies who don't pay or share the expenses can cause all sorts of problems. At least by myself I know exactly how to budget on my own without any 'surprises'
65. farmer Tom said the following at 7:31 PM on Nov 11:
48. Louise,
Comment 15, maybe the lady you were pursuing just didn't like you in a dating way.
Did you ever think of that?
You know what Louise, that was a stupid question. Let me quote what I said.
She had every excuse in the book why she would not date me. And she certainly has that right, God gave her a free will.
I acknowledged her right to reject my interest for whatever reason she wants. I in no way believe that she was required to return my interest in her.
But, you completely missed the point.
Her stubborn refusal to date me because I did not meet her standard of perfection, was carried over to the next guy who showed interest, and the next guy, and the next guy. I know of one guy in particular who asked her out, and she shot him down in flames the first time he asked. He didn't ask her again, instead he found someone less hostile to men and now he is happily married to a very sweet lady and they have a beautiful daughter.
And this gal, she's got................, a cat.
She is responsible for her choices. She repeatedly refused to date guys who were interested in her. Now she is 43 and single, and she has no one to blame but her self.
So all this talk about men who are set in their ways when they get older is a canard, a false flag, a gambit. And it does nothing to help the situation.
Anyone here who claims to want marriage is responsible for their own choices. You've been asked out and shot the guy down, maybe that's the last guy that will ever ask. Never been asked, maybe you are failing to present yourself as a potential wife and mother, your career is consuming your life or you need to take off the feed bag.
Frankly, I'm tired of the blame the men comments around here. The women bear a equal part of the responsibility. It seems to me that far to many of you are simply passing the buck. Blaming someone else for your situation, instead of considering how you can change some of your habits, actions or attitudes to make yourself a more attractive marriage partner.
66. farmer Tom said the following at 7:34 PM on Nov 11:
#52 said,
That is entertainment all it's own.
I'm sure it is completely justified, there are some really morons on the public highways.
67. elena said the following at 8:25 PM on Nov 11:
This article's example of conflict over how a toilet paper roll should unwind reminded me of a funny incident from my grandparents' marriage.
After my dad and his siblings grew up, Grandma babysat kids in her home. When reminiscing about the experience, she explained that making a toilet paper roll unwind from the back (under instead of over) kept little kids from unwinding the whole thing. Grandpa responded, "So that's why you did it like that." Although he disliked the practice, he apparently kept quiet until coincidentally hearing an explanation decades later!
Grandpa and Grandma married young, but any age can cultivate flexibility by overlooking harmless but annoying traits of family and friends. Hmmm, maybe I need to take my own hint :)
68. Susan H. said the following at 8:29 PM on Nov 11:
Dannie (#53), I'm not sure what your (valid) concerns about roommates who don't hold up their end have to do with the issue at hand. (Although it isn't true that only one renter's name is on a lease--most landlords require that everyone living there be on the lease.)
Yes, getting a roommate is a risk, but when you choose wisely and the other person is financially responsible, living together does provide good training in accommodating another person's preferences and habits. Perhaps for you it isn't worth the risk, but for many of us it is.
69. Louise from Chicago said the following at 9:06 PM on Nov 11:
Comment 65, I do not agree that it was a "stupid question."
It was a valid question.
In my opinion sir, you are very rude to the other people on here.
And I for one never stated that men "get set in their ways as they get older," and the rest of your post after that is really going off an a tangent.
If you are going to post on here, you might want to try to be a little more polite.
Just a hint of friendly advice.
And, FYI, I am forty four, single, and HAPPY!
:)
70. Dante said the following at 9:55 PM on Nov 11:
"So, many commenters have noted that resistance and stubborness in change is not simply a gender specific thing; and frankly, neither is it an age or marital status thing. Perhaps it is a maturity/character issue(which, I submit is not limited to age, marital status, gender, economic standing, or even geographical location."
I contest that marriage spurs maturity and helps build better character. It can be both the catalyst and vehicle, leading both parties up to the wedding date and then throughout their marriage. It's not the only way, but it's pretty darn good (and tough) from what I hear. Things worth having are rarely achieved easily. And I really am hard pressed to find a better scenario than two married believers united under a covenant intended to purify. This is part of marriage's design, regardless how we sinfully mess it up. The blueprint is flawless.
But I gotta admit, Sassy. I'm flattered that you singled me out. What is this that I feel between us?!
71. Andrea-Elena said the following at 10:50 PM on Nov 11:
FutureMrsAmir:
I would have dated your fiance, but I didn't fit his qualifications.
I've always been impressed with him. So you have "snagged" a quality man of God. You go, girl!!! *high-fives ya*
I'm thrilled for you both and am looking forward to the wedding story and photos!! How long until the special day?
72. BDB said the following at 11:22 PM on Nov 11:
Based on #60, it's clear that Farmer Tom will soon be contacting the Omaha Steak company for a delivery to Colorado Springs...
73. BDB said the following at 12:03 AM on Nov 12:
Kelly-1 (#63) wrote:
>> (After all, it's my house!)<<
Yep yep yep.
If I read correctly, they're family though, so you need to pick your battles.
Securing the front door is one worth fighting, in my opinion. Though I live in a neighborhood where it's possible to get away with leaving the door unlocked (as long as it's not generally known), it's a much better habit to keep everything locked up.
I came home from vacation once and discovered the back door unlocked. I couldn't remember if I had forgotten to lock it after taking the trash out, or if the cat sitter had not understood how to lock it properly. But my heart skipped a beat thinking it was unlocked for a week. Nothing was missing though.
74. BDB said the following at 1:09 AM on Nov 12:
You know, people CAN start to think of ways to be flexible in advance. It might even make you start thinking more positively about marriage.
For example, when I needed to buy my first lawn mower, I read online reviews. Nothing strange about that. But I ran across a well-written review by a guy who had grown up mowing the lawn, and expected his son to do the same.
Except he only had daughters.
Well, they can work, too. What he did was buy the model with a key start and self-propelled. Some women are literally too small to pull the cord on a lawnmower and get it to start. The key start solves that problem. The lawnmower still has the cord, of course, in case you forget to plug it in.
And the marginal difference in price is pretty small. So, if a lawnmower last 10 years, why not get one that everyone in the family can use someday?
75. farmer Tom said the following at 5:12 AM on Nov 12:
60. Thomas Jeffries,
Sir, I owe you a package of T-bone steak.
How would you like it delivered?
76. Jim said the following at 8:07 AM on Nov 12:
I am in exactly the same position as the first comment by Thomas Jeffries. I am the male pushing 40 and I have always considered myself set in my ways, NEVER wanting to get married. Last year I met a very Godly young woman who came to my church in her mid 20s. Our friendship has grown and I am at the crossroads, first time in my life I feel ready to "take the plunge" and sacrifice everything for her (including the risk of asking her out). I tried everything to forget her, to avoid her initially but it just failed. I trust God was and is doing something. I just lost interest in everyone else (of the opposite sex) which, trust me, is unusual for single men. Some of you may think its stupid or crazy, but I can tell you, you will know and you will be willing to change if it is the right person.
77. Loris said the following at 8:14 AM on Nov 12:
Charlie, my dad, also named Charlie, met my mom on the mission field. He was older too, and that was his first marriage. They're coming up on 27 years this summer. The downside is I now have elderly parents in poor health when I'm in the flower of my youth. I've benefited from their great wisdom and experience, but lost out on having healthy, energetic parents. It's a mixed bag because barring illness or accident, my husband won't be facing these issues with his parents for another 30 years. Of course, you didn't mention children, and I hope you will find a like-minded lady while you serve.
Vanessa, that situation would have made me mad too. My college roommate usually ate most of my care packages without permission. I got really mad the day I realized the sealed packaged of mint Oreos I'd stashed in my drawer was now a wrapper in the trash and I hadn't gotten any. Oh well. Hindsight tells me that she was having a tough time at college, both academically and emotionally and her parents were not supportive, neither monitarily nor emotionally. She needed those Oreos more than I did. However, your roommate needs to fess up to her unwelcome sharing of the peanut butter and she needs to supply the next jar.
Sassy Sister mentioned marrying young with the support of the community. I think that's the only way a young marriage can work. Without community support and advice, a young wife gets easily overwhelmed and feels scrutinized and judged (I know this firsthand) and the young husband gets bogged down trying to work his first real job with survival on the line (My husband still resents this and regrets not finishing college). The main benefits of young marriage are that both are hopefully still malleable, and there is more time together during the lifetime, Lord willing.
78. Sarah P. said the following at 8:18 AM on Nov 12:
Mr. Thomas (#65) said: Anyone here who claims to want marriage is responsible for their own choices. You've been asked out and shot the guy down, maybe that's the last guy that will ever ask. Never been asked, maybe you are failing to present yourself as a potential wife and mother, your career is consuming your life or you need to take off the feed bag.
Say, life is like a dance. At my conservative Christian college, we had many dances. The kids who are students now are much better about this, but in my day we wound up with large amounts of both girls and guys standing around and not dancing. Now, the fact of the matter is, even if you were a girl who would very much like to dance, you couldn't make it happen!
A girl can only take so much standing near the front of the crowd, looking hopeful and pleasant and feeling miserable. Then she goes to sit down for a while. So is it her fault she's not dancing? Or is the fault of the guys who are clustered around the food table?
79. Benjamin said the following at 8:19 AM on Nov 12:
"You know what Louise, that was a stupid question."
"Her stubborn refusal to date me because I did not meet her standard of perfection..."
"... he found someone less hostile to men..."
"Now she is 43 and single, and she has no one to blame but her self (sic)."
"It seems to me that far to (sic) many of you are simply passing the buck."
"I'm sure it is completely justified, there are some really (sic) morons on the public highways."
Someone didn't want to marry you? Color me shocked.
80. Amir Larijani said the following at 8:58 AM on Nov 12:
Benjamin says to Farmer Tom:
Actually, someone did marry him. And she was/is a keeper, as they have--if I'm not mistaken--4 kids.
81. Amir Larijani said the following at 9:00 AM on Nov 12:
Andrea-Elena says to FutureMrsLarijani:
Thanks, Andrea. You're too kind.
T minus 23 days.
82. IMO said the following at 9:09 AM on Nov 12:
#79
That's a really rude comment. You really feel qualified to make that statement?
83. Louise from Chicago said the following at 10:04 AM on Nov 12:
Comment 81,
From what I've seen of life rudeness usually goes straight back to its
original source.
Comment 80, I think the author of comment 79 meant "one particular person didn't want to marry you" rather than "no one wanted to marry you."
84. Jeremiah said the following at 10:10 AM on Nov 12:
One question I have struggled a lot with the last few years is, in addition to being too set in my ways, am I also now too bitter to be a good husband and father. At 32 my “being in a relationship” period adds up to less than probably 2 years. For all the other times there is so much I haven’t done, and so much long-term struggle and loneliness in its place.
Increasingly, the dating options I have available are women that have already been through a divorce, or had other long-term dating history. I try to be fair, but somewhere at my core I am mad at these women for giving some loser guy, who didn’t have the same intentionality for marriage, the best of their youth and then giving me (IMO, the quality guy) the used seconds. I know this is terrible attitude. I’m just very suspicious of single women my age.
85. Trevor Dolby said the following at 10:22 AM on Nov 12:
Sarah P. (78): I blame the guys but that's mostly because I've seen this problem myself elsewhere: loads of available ladies, and loads of guys sitting around not asking!
On the plus side, it leaves more ladies for me :) My strategy is usually to dance with the un-danced-with as much as I can, which seems to work out okay. That said, the situations I'm in are normally lower-pressure than a university dance.
Maybe I should put some effort into learning to dance with two girls at once . . .
86. Robby Hall said the following at 10:26 AM on Nov 12:
Ummm, all of the negative attacks aside. Most of us single men who are pushing 40 are single because, quite frankly, we weren't....something for the women we've asked out.
It's not by choice that we are single, it's by circumstance. How many times do you get shot down before you quit? We're not young enough, good looking enough, rich enough, successful enough (which some women think is the sign of a true christian male). It's always something.
We have our own fears, too. We don't want women who need us because we feel they will grow to resent it. We are afraid of single mom's for the same reason and because instant fatherhood is scary. But we try anyway only to get shot down for men who end up treating those women like dirt.
So, it's not so much that we want to be single as it is just not making someone's must have lists.
87. BDB said the following at 11:09 AM on Nov 12:
Jim (#76) - Sounds like you've prayed it through and it's time to talk to her.
88. farmer Tom said the following at 11:29 AM on Nov 12:
At my conservative Christian college, we had many dances.
Sorry Sarah P. but you confuse yourself and those who read your comments when you refer to your college as "conservative", then say that they had dances.
We can debate the merits of Christians dancing in another thread, but "conservative" ideology generally does not consider it acceptable behavior to engage in a scandalous activity like dancing. What is "conservative" about two unmarried people rubbing their bodies up against each other whether in public or private? Ask any guy on this thread if he has been to a dance and been sexually aroused by all the scantily dressed women, rubbing up against them, or shaking their booty to the beat? Those behaviors are not "conservative", even if done at a college which claims to be "conservative".
Furthermore, what exactly does a dance have to do with finding a marriage partner? Are you suggesting that having some guy rub up against you, make an attempt at groping you, and becoming sexually aroused, is how one goes about finding a suitable marriage partner? My limited mental abilities would conclude that such an atmosphere is exactly the kind of place to avoid meeting a potential mate. Since I would consider any young lady who engages is such behavior to be a tease, who uses her feminine charms to lead the guys on. Of course I'm old fashioned, even "conservative".
I would prefer to meet potential mates at a place where sexual tension is at a minimum. Where the Lord Jesus Christ is being honored, and the Truth of the Gospel is being shared. Like, say, church or a Bible conference, or a Christian camp.
89. DannieA said the following at 11:41 AM on Nov 12:
Susan,
I was responding to those who said that a way to help not become set in your ways was to get roommates.
I'm saying...the roommate analogy doesn't work and here is why. Yes some roommates are good, however, the ones that don't....well that is a nightmare life.
90. Amy said the following at 11:56 AM on Nov 12:
Seriously? Aren't we all supposed to be believers? May I suggest attitudes of humility and grace?
91. Jo said the following at 12:10 PM on Nov 12:
IMO 80,
farmer Tom is frequently just as rude to other people on the blog. I've grown to like him, but it took me a while. Maybe Benjamin will get there too. :)
DannieA
"With roommates ONE always has to be the bearer of the name on bills....mortgage/renter agreement and what if your roommates don't pay up?"
I know of lots of situations where that has been the case, but it doesn't have to be. My best friend/ex-roomy and I opened a joint account, worked out how much our bills tended to cost and each set up a standing order to that account for a bit more than necessary, so we'd never have a problem. Everything got paid from that account. A few people thought we were a bit weird for having a joint account but it worked perfectly, we never had a disagreement over money and when we moved out, we split what was left in the account and had a nice little bonus to take away. I don't know why other people don't do that.
92. Louise from Chicago said the following at 12:52 PM on Nov 12:
The moderators on here sandwiched a comment after I made my comment 83.
What was comment 81 when I made my comment 83 is now comment 82.
Moderators please correct this.
Thank you.
Louise Mcbride
93. Sarah P. said the following at 1:16 PM on Nov 12:
Farmer Tom, there are many different kinds of dancing. I have never in my life "rubbed my body up against" a man. The dances at my appropriately conservative but not legalistic college are not officially sponsored and are organized off-campus. They typically involve contra dancing, swing, and waltz, with some other ballroom dancing tossed in for good measure. Outfits are (usually) tasteful.
I do want to learn ballroom dancing properly someday, but I am saving that for when I have a husband (and am willing to forego it if he has two left feet). This is because so much of truly excellent ballroom dancing does involve getting close with your partner.
I have found that the way people behave at dances offers an excellent metaphor for the way they behave with the opposite sex in general. I know that before I learned to "follow" well, it seemed much easier to lead. Now I can follow, I respect a man's skill in leading the dance and the difficulty of his part.
94. Sarah P. said the following at 1:22 PM on Nov 12:
Also (still to Farmer Tom): I would prefer to meet potential mates at a place where sexual tension is at a minimum. Where the Lord Jesus Christ is being honored, and the Truth of the Gospel is being shared. Like, say, church or a Bible conference, or a Christian camp.
I believe all creation shows the glory of God. I write stories, and I aim to make movies. Our Lord Jesus is shown through the "peace of those who make peace," through the "firmaments display[ing] His handiwork," etc. His skill is also shown in the beauty of a painting, a song, a story, or a dance. A farmer can glorify God in his daily life, as can a plumber. So I reject the notion that it is any more holy to go to a Bible conference than to a dance.
God bless,
Sarah P.
95. BDB said the following at 1:27 PM on Nov 12:
House Guest update: It seems that I had some "help" unloading the dishwasher. My primary cooking spatulas disappeared. Luckily I found them after a short search - and before my breakfast burned!
96. Tami said the following at 1:30 PM on Nov 12:
Robby (86), trust me, some of us have dated the "pushing 40" guys -- after *they* pursued *us* -- and gotten dumped because we weren't "something" for them, either. (And unfortunately for me, that "something" is a mystery, so I can't even learn from it.) So it definitely goes both ways.
97. Vanessa said the following at 2:40 PM on Nov 12:
#84 - Sorry you're in that situation. You're about the first guy I've heard complain about that, honestly. I kind of thought that was a "girl thing."
98. Lisa said the following at 2:50 PM on Nov 12:
Hi Jeremiah (#84)
A never-married, never-dated, almost 32-year-old woman here. And I could probably list a dozen women in the same category: women from strong families who love the Lord, and simply (for whatever reason, perhaps known only to Him) haven't gotten married yet. I know it seems like we're mythical creatures. But we're not. We fight with bitterness, too, but we serve too great and too kind a God to succumb to it. Hang in there! Trust Him. For all I know, your future wife may be praying for you right now. Jesus certainly is!
99. Benjamin said the following at 3:06 PM on Nov 12:
"farmer Tom is frequently just as rude to other people on the blog. I've grown to like him, but it took me a while. Maybe Benjamin will get there too. :)"
My comment was a bit snarky, sure, but I think that can be useful every now and then. I have no idea what Farmer Tom is like in real life, because I am sure he portrays himself differently online from the rest of life (don't we all?). But on here he comes across as an uneducated-and-proud jerk who is incredibly rude and comically condescending to those who disagree with him, and I thought a response in kind might be appropriate.
Also, for what it's worth, I don't think dancing has been widely considered "scandalous" for nigh on a century. Maybe some have only seen dancing on TV, but let me assure you that a Christian college dance has considerably less sexual rubbing than Farmer Tom imagines.
100. DannieA said the following at 3:15 PM on Nov 12:
Farmer Tom,
I went to a conservative Christian College in Texas (not TCU) and there were no sponsored dances however, some people began relationships after going to the neighboring town's country western 2 step dances on the weekend. Let me give you the scenario. It was in a barn, elderly people ran it and only served water...
no scantily clad women....everyone was very country...men with their jeans, plaid shirts and hats sometimes, and women in jeans and country style shirts.
I think you were thinking of more um night club dancing scenarios.