More Singles at Megachurches
by Heather Koerner on 06/18/2009 at 11:42 AM
According to a new study, "Not Who You Think They Are: The Real Story of People Who Attend America's Megachurches", young and single adults make up a larger proportion of megachurch congregations than they do of smaller congregations.
In what the authors describe as the "first major national survey of megachurch attenders," the study looks at three major themes:
- Who attends a megachurch
- Why they come
- Why some stay (their italics, not mine)
In the first theme, "Who attends a megachurch?", the study found some similarities between the congregations of megachurches and those of smaller churches. Both congregations are "predominantly female, well-educated, middle class and married with children." But, the study states, "if one looks closer at the information, significant differences emerge."
Specifically, megachurch congregations are "considerably younger" and have "many more singles."
Considerably Younger: Nearly two-thirds of megachurch attenders are under 45 years old, while only a third are for the all-church sample. Megachurches also have a significantly higher percentage of 18- to 24-year-olds in their congregations (18%) compared to typical churches (5%).
Many More Singles: Single adults represent about 10% of a typical American church congregation. However, they represent almost one-third of a megachurch congregation. "Interestingly," the authors write, "these single attenders were twice as likely to be living with other singles when compared to churches of other sizes, but equal in percentage for those living alone. This suggests that perhaps a larger percentage of the megachurch singles are students, a perception confirmed in our visits to the megachurches."
That got me to wondering why young singles seem to prefer megachurches. According to the study, worship style is the strongest factor in initial attraction to a megachurch, followed by senior pastor, church reputation and music/arts. If that worship and teaching are biblically sound, then this trend could be a fine thing.
But I am concerned about the lack of older Christians, older marrieds and older parents in megachurches. Wouldn't it be difficult to benefit from the wisdom of mentors when there are so few? How can we learn from marriages that have stood the test of time if we're surrounded by those who are either aren't or are only recently married? How can we learn from parents who have brought up their children in fear and admonition of the Lord if we never actually see them?
Christian maturity is not limited by age but I've also learned over the past decade that I shouldn't discount the benefits of a life lived following the Lord. Perhaps your experience is different. But, when I'm honest, I realize that the best and most sound biblical advice I've received are from those who are able to look back at my life stage, not those who are participating in it with me.
What about you? Do you attend a megachurch or a smaller church? Do you see pros or cons to either?
1. Tami said the following at 11:58 AM on Jun 18:
I would say my experience bears this out.
I attend a smaller (but not tiny) church. There aren't many people my age there -- even fewer that are unmarried and my age. But I am around a lot of godly, mature, older believers, who model discipleship to me, and from whom I learn a lot.
2. NeedACatchyName said the following at 12:21 PM on Jun 18:
It's been my experience that, whether they want to admit it or not, most singles would probably rate "chances of finding a mate" at the top of things they look for in a church. Megachurches have more people, so from a single's perspective, that increases your chance of finding a mate. The non-mega church that I attend has exactly two single females in their twenties who are regular attendees, and they're both in "I'm too busy to be in a relationship in this phase of my life" mode, so the pool of single, available females at my church is essentially nonexistent. I have a feeling if I were at a megachurch, my chances of finding a mate would increase. So I would offer that as a reason why singles like megachurches.
One other thing I also see (and maybe this is just in my area) is singles who attend smaller churches going to a megachurch for a mid-week singles' Bible study on some evening that their church isn't doing anything. That way, they get to attend the church they want to attend on Sunday mornings, but can still reap some of the benefits of the larger pool of potential romantic interests at a megachurch. I've never done this, but it's an intriguing idea and one I might yet do.
3. obewan said the following at 12:21 PM on Jun 18:
I attend a mega church that does not fit the profile in the article. It does have one of the largest singles ministries in town, but still, the singles only represent about 5% of the church body. It used to host a multi-church para-church singles outreach that met on Thursdays, and the attendance there was about 10% of the regular church body (of aprox 4000), but many people came from other churches.
We have a number of senior citizens who either tolerate the modern music or attend their own traditional ministry. There are also many teens - hundreds to be exact. Many families attend due to the good youth programs, and that is what has made it a mega church. The parents are happy that their kids are attracted to the contemporary worship program, and that has brought in whole families - some even from Catholic backgrounds who made the switch for their kid’s sakes and found a new faith as Protestants.
There are over 400 small groups that meet in homes, and give a New Testament house church atmosphere to the mix. There are many older mature Christians who lead these groups. There is even a men’s fraternity with a mentoring program that connects older and younger men. I have several men friends who are retired, and that is a good thing because they have helped by driving me home from medical procedures where I was not allowed to drive myself, whereas my single friends had to work.
I will be honest in stating that I am there because of the singles ministry, but I really have few other choices since it seems the overwhelming majority of churches cut people off from organized singles ministry at age 30. I would not be there if I had to make any theological compromises or sacrifice growth though, so I don’t feel bad about seeking my own “social” interests too. Past experience has shown me that isolation, loneliness, and depression may result in the absence of good peer group fellowship.
4. BDB said the following at 12:22 PM on Jun 18:
My church was about 300 people when I started attending. We run a weekly attendance over 5000 now, and when we re-did our database last fall, over 10,000 people, including children, signed up. Without really planning to, we became a megachurch.
Why has it grown so much? Well, it's definitely grown up around the Senior Pastor's teaching. He never really wanted to be a pastor, but felt God call him to it. As he explains, the church's growth is an overnight success 40 years in the making, because it took a long time and a variety of settings for God to shape the Senior Pastor into being a Senior Pastor.
One theory we have is that people are socialized in larger groups now. The high schools in my area have 3000+ students, compared to my high school with just 1300. Then people attend huge state universities with tens of thousands of students, compared to a liberal arts college with, say, 1200. The average person is comfortable with maybe 250 active relationships with people. In organizations of that size, people seem to be used to finding their own niche.
Most people don't know the senior pastor, of course. That's why there are small groups. There is a young-adults ministry which has more than 150 attendees. It's not limited to single people. But it's also only on Wednesday nights plus social events they have.
The other reality that large church's have is that in order to function successfully, they need systems in place. We run four servies a weekend, and we need about 700 Children's Ministry volunteers to make it work over the course of a year. This creates huge opportunities for young adults to volunteer - often with older Christians. They still do the young-adults group on Wednesdays, but on Sundays (and Sat. Night) they are attending the service and/or volunteering.
The structure of the economy has changed a lot in the last 50 years, too. I know a number of mentoring-oriented couples. But I also know pro-marriage couples without much education. They don't understand why it's valuable...and are unable to provide much in the way of mentoring when it comes to surviving in the economy, though they lament that their children will probably never be able to afford a house. Without some post-high-school education, that's probably true.
In the last couple of years, I've come into a contact with a whole bunch of 20-somethings I've met volunteering in some part of the church. Many of them are recent graduates or attending college, slowly trying to finish as they can get classes.
The process of doing grown-up things in a volunteer setting regularly brings young people into contact with older and/or more mature believers. When young adults decide to hold an official "small group," they come under the same semi-formal mentoring framwork we have for small-group leaders who are married couples. The same thing happens in worship team ministry, where the 24-year-old single woman might be singing beside the 44-year-old married woman on the 3rd weekend of the month. (We organize worship teams by certain assigned weeks.)
Mentoring will probably only be sought out by those that want to learn. But I can't think of any reason why a small church would provide more opportunities for mentoring.
It might provide more opportunities for meddling because it's harder for people to get away...
5. Mishy from SouthBayAreaCali said the following at 12:27 PM on Jun 18:
I guess for me I attend a small community church where I live. They have good worship and good teaching, but sad to say they lack many young adults. I am of the single's group the youngest and I'm 26. Everyone else is either older and single in their 30's and 40's. They call it career group but honestly when I think of career group I would think of people in their mid to late 20's and maybe 30's. Its so hard to try to relate to others much older than me. Although I have to say I've learned much from them. Some smaller churches seem to have clicks going on though too. If your the new person sometimes people come up to you, but it seems you have to make the effort to go up to them. I think small churches but if your one who is becoming marriage minded and looking for that person then I think a megachurch would probably be better. The one and only reason of going to a megachurch should not be to look for that person, but also it should have the others factors of good spirit filled worship, good biblically sound word and so on. My church doesn't really have a bible study per say for the singles, so I'm beginning to wonder if I need to find another church where I can have that community of young adults in my age bracket that I can fellowship with. I am feeling somewhat lonely and my only other place of meeting people is work and that really isn't the best place to find good friends that are christian. Most of the people i work with aren't christian and aren't born again. I for sure realize that's God's timing is the best when it comes to meeting someone for companionship, so ultimately I don't want my motive to be only that when finding a new church. I think it helps though when there is a bigger variety of people when going to a megachurch. Although sometimes I wonder at megachurches if people are really biblically grounded or if they just come and go without changing. I know that's not for me to determine but that's between them and God. Ultimately, I think switching to a mega church could be more beneficial if looking for a bigger group for community sake. I also don't like the feeling of being lost sort of speak in a big church. That's why becoming involved is the best way to not feel lost in the crowd of people. I'm still praying about it, but I think finding a bigger church could be the cure to finding more young adults my age. Its sad that the smaller churches don't have more young adults, but you know it is what it is. I really do need to connect with young adults closer to my age because I'm tired of just coming home and watching movies and tv while others are out. My brother is always out with his girlfriend, which is cool but I think its my turn. I need to take the step to find community, and as I take the step I am believing God is leading. I know what he has ultimately is the best he wants for me. If anyone has any thoughts to help me out please let me know. :)
Thanks boundless for looking out for our interests and seeking the Lord to what he would have you guys speak to us. You guys rock, keep it up!
6. Kari said the following at 12:48 PM on Jun 18:
I am in a small church (about 160 adults every Sunday)and while it is a Great Commission Church-- designed more for students and young professionals, I think we have a fairly good variety of families. We do have quite a few newly married or still childless married couples (most in their upper twenties)and TONS of families with children ranging from 0-10.... but we have a definite lack of older couples. I can think of maybe 3 couples that are older than 40, and if you count the pastors,then 5.
I guess I have never thought of it before. It's kinda sad actually-- I wish we did have some older couples to be able to talk with.
7. hlc said the following at 1:05 PM on Jun 18:
I attend a very large church and aside from the teaching and worship style that attracted me, I also enjoyed having a large community of other young people around, which may be why we "flock" together. My church has started having several of the older men and women start mentoring groups for the young adults, which has been well-received.
8. Tami said the following at 1:17 PM on Jun 18:
NeedaCatchyName, I second your second paragraph :)
9. Tami said the following at 1:25 PM on Jun 18:
BDB wrote:
Mentoring will probably only be sought out by those that want to learn.
Yup, this part is true anywhere.
But I can't think of any reason why a small church would provide more opportunities for mentoring.
Well, it depends on the church... if your pastor is emphatic that discipleship *will happen,* then regardless of size, the church will offer many, many opportunities for mentoring -- not just one on one, but via small groups, and within other ministries themselves.
My experience is becoming this: some people -- generally the more motivated and involved ones, or those used to the concept of formal discipleship because of their involvement in groups like Navigators or Campus Crusade -- recognize their need for mentorship. Then, others notice the fruit that this bears, and want to have mentors as well.
10. Renee said the following at 1:47 PM on Jun 18:
Considering what passes for being a christian today, what makes you think a person who is married or older is qualified to be my mentor.
Marrieds and older people are in just as much trouble if not more than young singles.
Its so annoying to be treated like I am 7 because I am 28 and not married.
Has anyone ever stopped to think the reason people attend mega churches is to scope out real christian friends? Along with that, (as was said) they want a mate. The third reason is prefered isolation.
In small churches force you into their socialization structure and then try to put you to work in the church. They assume that your extra time should be theirs because you dont have kids or a husband. This is particulary problematic for christian girls.
I want to be able to blend in and disapear when I want. I also want real singles ministries not meat markets. The people who run them should be older singles who know that singles at my age have work, school, a second job, a house to maintain, a business they are starting, volunteer work - or whatever else that is taking up their time.
All of those small churches are going to die if they dont change.
NOW
11. obewan said the following at 2:08 PM on Jun 18:
#9. Tami said the following at 1:25 PM on Jun 18
"Well, it depends on the church... if your pastor is emphatic that discipleship *will happen,* then regardless of size, the church will offer many, many opportunities..."
That is true, the megachurch I attend is a case in point.
The senior pastor 4 years ago rewrote the church "mission statement". It is now a simple three words: Connect, Grow, and Serve, with the project focus being More Disciples, Better Disciples...That focus has become the theme of numerous sermons, and is taught to every new member.
12. Nicole said the following at 2:15 PM on Jun 18:
The church that I attend and serve with has roughly 300 people. On most Sundays, myself and one other person are the only 20-somethings present. I was a part of a small group with four older married couples for about six months. As much as I liked them, the experience was very isolating. After speaking with one of the pastors about my frustrations, I was given the green light to seek community elsewhere.
So now I also attend a post-college group at a very large church (2500+ people). I am so thankful for the ministry that this large church is able to provide. It is such an encouragement to meet other people in their 20s who are intent on following Christ. In addition, expectations for young perople are so much higher than they are at the smaller church that I attend, where the attitude seems to be, "We're lucky if young people get up early enough to be here on Sunday."
13. Ronnica said the following at 2:25 PM on Jun 18:
Our church is medium-large (700-800 or so), and I know several singles have left for bigger churches because there are more singles there (meaning potential mates). I believe that my church family is just that--a family--and I'm sticking with them even if that means I'll be single the rest of my life. They're more important than a potential future mate.
As far as church size, I love that our church has commited to grow smaller as it grows larger. I'm a part of the larger church, yes, but I'm also a part of a small care group. Those are the people that will encourage me.
14. Tamara (from Canada) said the following at 2:37 PM on Jun 18:
Hmm . . . never thought about it, I guess my church would fall into the mega church category. But through the use of multiple meeting sites ( we meet in 5 different locations around the city) and multiple services (both Saturday night and Sunday morning), it still has the small church feel that it had when I was growing up in it. Most people have their usual service that they attend, and then for large church celebrations and a couple of other special events we all meet at a Bible camp nearby . . . that's when it seems like a really big church.
On the topic of more singles . . . I would say not really . . . there is a group of probably about 100-150 of us, but in a church of 2000 that's not too many. Our mid-week young adults (for single or married, age 18 - mid 30s) can attract more than that because we have working relationships with some of the smaller churches in our city who don't have enough young adults to have their own ministry for them to join us.
Mentoring . . . having gone to this church most of my life and also having gone to a much smaller church while I was away at school . . . if someone actually takes the time to find mentors then it can happen regardless of the size of the church. In our world today, perhaps unfortunately, mentoring does not just happen, you have to seek it out. But, I have found that if you take even just a few minutes to reach out for a mentor you can find one pretty easily. Whether that means phoning the church office during the week, or talking to one of the leaders in a ministry you serve in or attend, or just watching some people for a while and then asking them. Mentoring usually requires that you take action.
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Renee (#10) said:
Considering what passes for being a christian today, what makes you think a person who is married or older is qualified to be my mentor.
Marrieds and older people are in just as much trouble if not more than young singles.
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That may often be the case, but there are also many married or older people who have a lot of wisdom about life. It's not necessarily that they have it all together or that they've never made mistakes. of course we all have. But, there is incredible value in having (as one of my mentors put it) "someone who has fallen down a few more times" in life to listen, pray for, offer encouragement/advice. Basically that person outside of your peer group to help you see things you might otherwise miss.
15. Rich Bordner said the following at 3:11 PM on Jun 18:
The problem you note, Heather, of a lack of older adults in a congregation, and therefore a lack of wisdom, is a problem I've seen and felt at my own church in Southern CA. I remember a while back a stat at my church being thrown around...it was something like "48% of our congregation is between the ages of 18-26."
I've always thought there were advantages and disadvantages to this. Advantage: lots of energy to do ministry. Disadvantage: we keep reinventing the wheel and stepping in the same potholes in the street. We keep making the same mistakes. A running joke at my church is that when you hear a sermon, you'll hear the same sermon on the same text next year.
Very few at my church seem to recognize the liabilities.
16. T.Smith said the following at 3:23 PM on Jun 18:
I attend a large church because they offer a men's group. Unlike NeedACatchyName, I am not seeking a mate and tend to avoid classes with many females.
17. Tara said the following at 3:27 PM on Jun 18:
I'm a little fascinated by the idea of mentoring, and I understand Renee's (#10) frustration with it. At what age do you stop needing a mentor and are eligible to become a mentor yourself? Is being married the only qualification to being a mentor? I'm getting married on Sept. 19; will I be eligible to be a mentor on Sept. 20? (That was partially sarcastic, but really, what are the limits?)
Quite by accident, my former piano teacher served as my mentor from age 10 to 18. It was a wonderful relationship and she helped me grow. But I think something like that is rare, and it could be unhealthy to push mentoring relationships onto young people. I mean, how does it work, exactly? You go to a new church, walk up to a new person, and say "hey, be my mentor"? These things take time. It's not something that can be forced. And yet I get the feeling that many Christians believe that if a young person does NOT have a mentor, that something is terribly wrong.
18. Julia H said the following at 4:29 PM on Jun 18:
On the subject of mentoring: I have heard a saying that every Christian should ideally have a Timothy and a Paul in their lives (that is, a mentee and a mentor.) I also think that marital status is not necessarily a prerequisite for a good mentor. Instead, I would look for someone who is spiritually mature and has many years in the faith. As for being a mentor, consider making relationships with younger people or new Christians in your church. Start a friendship. Mentorship is not something that has to be formal.
19. a sasy sister said the following at 5:37 PM on Jun 18:
I agree with Julia H.
Mentoring does not have to be formal. But I also believe that like any other relationship, intentions, communication, and boundaries need to be made known and kept. I certainly agree that older people have wisdom that younger people can definitely glean from. But I also believe that young people have something to offer older people as well. Also, I believe that there must be a foundation of trust, safety, respect, and accountability already operating in a church if you want mentoring and community among all age groups in church. Also, I believe it's crucial to understand that mentoring is not simply for marriage preparation, but for every aspect of life.
As a Christian, your life should be one of growth and giving---growing in God and giving and passing on what you've learned in community with other believers who are coming after you. Every one of us have opportunities to learn more, grow more, and show God's love more so that others can hear/receive the gospel and become believers.
20. Scott Arnold said the following at 6:43 PM on Jun 18:
Three things:
The thing about Renee's post that struck me was this:
"I want to be able to blend in and dissapear when I want."
It's a "hiding" mentality. That's not the mentality we need to have as Christians with regards to church. When we give our lives to Jesus, we are basically coming out of hiding and saying "I come to you knowing that I am wicked and deserving of judgement. I will no longer hide in the bushes acting as if God doesn't know where I am." (like in Eden!) In a sense, we are revealing ourselves.
However, it is a beautiful, saving revelation as we throw ourselves at the foot of the cross. We fully come to terms that we are wicked, and that we are nothing but evil.
I mention this because of two reasons. First, since we have accepted the blood of Christ, we are now called to walk in the light. (1 John for an example, although there's plenty of references). The light reveals us. We can't hide in the light. That plays itself out in that part of walking in the light is revealing yourself (both the gifts and the sins!) in Godly community, so that God will use other people to shape you into a person more in his image.
The other is that we are the light of the world, and we are not to put our lamp of Christ underneath a bowl.
With that said, the key takeaway is that we need to go to church with a mentality of contributing and serving the community! Don't be a "consumer" of church, be a part of it.
Second:
Mentoring/disciplining needs to happen in any church. Marital status shouldn't matter at all, and if you're treated as a kid because you're not married (assumption: you are not single because you are basically acting like one), then there's some issues. As Julia says in #18, it's about people who are more mature in their faith who have a desire to see others grow walking with and building into others who are still growing, sort of as a senior in college might help a freshman get accustomed to school.
Thirdly:
Megachurches probably have more singles because they have a large single population. As silly as it sounds, it makes sense to me. Like attracts like, so it seems. A church that has a "singles scene" will be more comfortable for another single to join. There's more to it, but as a demographic of a church starts to take shape (which largely depends on the community you're in! If you're in my town for example, you're going to get a lot of young professionals, because of where you are!), those who are older need to invest in those who are younger, regardless of the demographics.
It's sort of the way this culture works. ;p
21. Kelly said the following at 6:54 PM on Jun 18:
NeedACatchyName - Yes, I do that.
I go to my small church on Sunday mornings, and a much bigger church on Wednesday evenings for Bible study (and sometimes to their Sunday night services). Why? Because my "home church" is basically my family: as someone with a lot of siblings who have now married other church kids, I'm related to practically everyone in the church!
Ideally I'll meet a great man at the "Megachurch" and bring him back to my small church (or me to his).
Of course, the whole time I've been at the Bigger Church, my Bible study group consists of 2 couples and 7 other single women. At least I've made some great friendships!
---
Finally, reading all the other comments:
My small church has 40 people, my Big Church has 400. Guess that's not quite what you were talking about after all. ;)
22. Leah said the following at 7:22 PM on Jun 18:
I'm very cycnical about megachurches.
I go to a church that has a daily attendance of probably about 250 people. We have two morning services and an evening service, but 80% of the evening service are people who also attend a morning service. As it is there are people who I don't know, but there's nobody I don't recognise and wouldn't smile at in the street. (I think!)
A lot of our church are young singles. That's due to a few reasons. Our city's university is a ten minute drive from our church, so we have a lot of uni students. Also, both the christian staffworkers on campus go to our church, so while they don't try to 'steal' students from other churches, many students do get in touch with our church through them (or through older siblings who are already here). Our church is also one of the few in our city that has a combination of solid bible teaching with 'contemporary' music. Most of the other churches in our city make you choose one or the other, and in a generation where uni students are becoming more and more desirous of solid bible teaching, they're giving up the charismatic churches with good music but watered-down theology. Sure, our church is not as 'hip' and funky and rock-concerty as those churches, but it has better music than most of the other reformed, conservative churches around the place :P So I think that is a draw-card for the young singles too.
However, I wouldn't say young singles make up a majority of our church. I'd say the majority are made up of middle-aged married couples (in their 40s/50s) & their kids. There's also an increasing number of young families (so parents in their late 20s/early 30s with young children). But on either end of that we have a large number of young singles, and a solid base of older couples (some with kids who have families of their own in the church, or some whose kids have moved away). I think we have a good mix :)
I also don't like megachurches because so many people fall through the cracks and can come and go without their absence being noticed. Sure, you get a few who fall through the cracks at smaller churches too, but not as many. My husband comes from a large church (big for our city, but wouldn't qualify as 'mega') of about 800 people. And he hated how cliquey it was. The leaders never interacted with the 'plebs'. I've said this before on Boundless, but my husband was blown away when we were invited into my minister's house for pre-marriage counselling. Back in his old church, normal congregants would never have been invited into the minister's home (and this is coming from my husband who was actually involved in some of the leadership teams). I like to be able to know most of the people in my church, even if it's just well enough to say 'hi', and to know they're part of my 'family'. I feel like that's not possible in a megachurch.
Tara (17) - It really depends on who you're mentoring. If there's an engaged couple wanting a mentor couple, then yeah, I guess you'd have to be married, wouldn't you? :P But if there's a 19 year old college student just wanting a spiritual mentor, then a single (or married) 30 year old is probably fine for the job. Just like a married 30-year-old couple might still have a married 50-year-old couple while being mentors to a dating 19-year-old couple.
I also see mentoring as something that is rare, so I've never been under the impression that "many Christians believe that if a young person does NOT have a mentor, something is terribly wrong".
Tamara (14) - the way you described your church, what makes it one church and not a network of several churches? Our church is currently looking at doing a church plant in the northern reaches of our city. The general idea at the moment is that we find them their own minister and that a core group leaves our church to start that church, and after 5 years of us weaning them (so each year they get less financial assistance from us, etc) they will be an independent church (while still being part of the same denomination and still being our 'partners', like our other churches are around the city). But they'll have their own church camp, their own youth groups etc.
But then another suggestion was raised that we could just build another "ministry centre" out there and hold church services for the people in the north, and keep the rest of the ministries combined. Then the reverse was suggested: that our ministry centre in the north be used to run other ministries, but we encourage people to come into the main church for the Sunday service.
23. Kathryn said the following at 8:03 PM on Jun 18:
I attend a small church of about 40. And we're split across two congregations! I love my church very much because, unlike my previous church, there is diversity. I went to a "uni" church, whose main demographic was uni students. It was also rather big. I love the fellowship I have with my "parents" and "grandparents" and "baby brothers and sisters" in my church. Fellowship with people my own age I get at my Christian group at my university. :)
24. mary kate said the following at 9:11 PM on Jun 18:
i attend a mega church. i started going there because yes, there were more single people my age there than any other church in my area.
that was about 5 or 6 years ago. i've stayed there because i love it. at my church, i see people's lives changed dramatically on a regular basis. also, it's a place i can bring my friends, and they won't be freaked out. plus, the coffee's awesome. (ok, so i'd still go even if they stopped the coffee :)
the drawbacks? yes, there are not tons of older people. but that has changed, and keeps changing. the big thing i've noticed is that just because a guy (or girl) is going to church there regularly and is involved with ministry work, that doesn't mean his values match yours. people at my church come from all kinds of varied backgrounds, so you really have to spend time getting to know people, and not make assumptions about their spiritual lives. but i think that's a good thing.
bottom line, there's less fakey 'religiousness.' every year or year and a half, the paster does a series about being real. during that series, he talks about how you need to be the same person in different circumstances. to bring the point home, he talks about how if it's ok for him to drink a beer on his back deck with his friends, it should be ok to drink one at church in front of the congregation. and he does! i love it. the next service in the series, he talks about all the emails he gets from people who freak out about the beer-drinking. and he tells them to get over it :)
i love my church!
25. Christopher from Albuquerque said the following at 4:53 AM on Jun 19:
I am a member of a church which has an average Sunday attendance of about 1,200 people (church members and attenders/visitors), spread out over two morning services.
I have had a much harder time getting to know people in this church than in my previous one, which wasn't exactly small (between 600-850 people on Sunday morning), *but* my previous church took great pains to ensure that there were *not* multiple services on Sunday morning. They even made renovations to the building to create space for more people, rather than add a second or third service.
This made a HUGE difference in getting to know people and building relationships. All of the church, the whole family, very young to very old, was there together in one place, at one time. Also, there was no "singles' ministry," per se, but there were very helpful classes on courtship (or "Biblical dating") and marriage, and there was encouragement from older saints about marriage.
In my current church, there are two morning services. Unlike most of the members or attenders, I try to go to both services. It's an issue of principle for me-- if I'm only going to one service, I'm only getting to know part of my family.
There is a college and young adult ministry at the church, out of which many people have gotten married, but the orientation of the ministry is teaching and evangelism, not getting singles married (and I think that's a good thing, overall). That doesn't stop people from meeting and getting married though. Actually, the deep, challenging teaching may actually encourage it.
However, there is next to nothing at the church for 30-plus singles, and the application points of the sermons are much more often pointed toward married couples than singles, and especially older singles.... I am praying that this will change. In most other ways, I love the church (theologically Reformed, plural elder leadership, instead of CEO pastor, and an emphasis on community and international missions).
26. Esther said the following at 6:37 AM on Jun 19:
I wonder if this tendency to avoid inter-generational interaction comes from our school (and Sunday School) system? From our earliest years, we were strictly segregated by age, and encouraged to socialize with our peers, so that's where we're most comfortable. Perhaps we never learned how to relate to people of many different ages?
As for church, my family had a home church, so I was expected to sit and listen and participate (as much as I was able) even while very young. It was challenging to a youngster who very much wanted to be somewhere else, but now I appreciate the mental and spiritual discipline I learned there. I am also quite comfortable relating to all sorts of people now, not just my own age group (which might not have been as true if I had been in normal age-segregated Sunday Schools or youth programs.
27. Tara said the following at 7:31 AM on Jun 19:
Thanks, folks, for your thought-provoking comments about mentoring. :-)
28. Leah said the following at 8:39 AM on Jun 19:
mary kate - interesting. I found more fake 'religiousness' at my husband's old "mega" church. Or maybe that was just the bad theology standing out like a sore thumb.
You know what, I think your pastor is wrong about the beer-drinking analogy. There are many people within the church who disagree with drinking alcohol, and while I think they're wrong, I wouldn't go flaunting the fact I drink alcohol in front of them. Paul explicity instructed us not to be stumbling blocks. He knew eating pork was fine, but he wasn't going to eat it in front of those Christian Jews who were still convinced it wasn't kosher in case he became a stumbling block.
So you wouldn't be drinking beer on the back porch to hide; you'd be doing it so you don't cause problems for people who might disagree.
And telling people to "get over" their issues from the pulpit is wrong. Paul didn't tell the Jews to "get over" their problem with eating pork. Although he did lovingly encourage them to put it behind them, he wasn't going to make a big fuss about it in front of hundreds of other people.
29. Pak said the following at 8:45 AM on Jun 19:
To add to 14's response to 10 about what qualifies an older or married person to be a mentor to someone younger or single, just look up the word origins of mentor (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/mentor). It's typically someone who's had more life experiences and who more often than not, IS older than the person being mentored. That being said, I would consider it a pride issue to outright reject the counselings of someone who's walked the path before me. I can learn from the mistakes of others as well as I can from my own.
#17 - Mentoring is not something that's really stops or starts at a certain age. You would probably look at the relationship of the possible mentor/mentee. A high school senior can mentor a sophomore with regards to what classes to take, teachers to avoid, etc. An 82-year old deacon can be a mentor to the senior pastor of a church and so forth.
30. BDB said the following at 1:47 PM on Jun 19:
mary kate (#24) - my pastor has a similar approach with the integrity issue and alcohol. In his case, he took the opposite tack - he felt convicted as a youth pastor that he should not be drinking because it sets a bad example, and so he stopped drinking alcohol.
Though I do think there is New Testament precedent for altering one's behavior depending on one's company. Romans 14:1-3 provides an example:
1 Receive one who is weak in the faith, but not to disputes over doubtful things. 2 For one believes he may eat all things, but he who is weak eats only vegetables. 3 Let not him who eats despise him who does not eat, and let not him who does not eat judge him who eats; for God has received him.
So, if one is around those who do not eat meat for religious reasons, we should adjust to not eat meat around them and so cause them to stumble.
In a ministry setting, the reason we do not allow alcohol is that there are a lot of people who are recovering from substance abuse. To consume alcohol in front of them is extremely insensitive. So, our church events have a no alcohol rule. This allows people to interact in a church setting regardless of whether they believe drinking alcohol is permissible.
I mean, while it would be acceptable for him to have sex with his wife in private, I'm assuming that he's not doing that on stage, right?
31. obewan said the following at 2:22 PM on Jun 19:
BDB #30 and Mary Kate #24:
Our church has a similar policy about alcohol. The church does not preach against it per se, but the pastor frequently says that he "does not see how much good can come from alcohol."
Many of the singles do consume table wine (with great moderation), but not if they know it will offend or stumble someone else. But, the official policy on singles events is no alcohol.
The church is quite aware and sensitive regarding this subject because they have a huge Celebrate Recovery ministry with dozens of recovering substance abuse addicts.
However, when I was attending an ultra conservative Plymouth Brethren (Bible) church, the pastor used his drinking of just one beer as a sermon illustration regarding Christian liberty. He had finished mowing his lawn on a hot sweltering day, and his neighbor brought him a cold beer. To avoid offending the man, he actually drank it and wound up inviting that guy to church. I don’t know how many people that sermon stumbled, but it set me free from some issues I had struggled with in the past.
32. loreferguson said the following at 2:56 PM on Jun 19:
I'm in a college town so more than half of our 500 is made up of students from the four universities. The exciting thing is that the other half of the congregation is made up of established families: it's a perfect set-up for training young leaders. 90% of our staff is made of up college students from the past 25 years who stayed on because of the deep relationships they built here. The group that is being groomed for leadership currently are students who've graduated in the past five-ten years.
There are cons to being in any sort of church, large, small or medium. The pro is always what the church can do and is doing to be active in the community. One thing that we practice around here is a small group model, but more of a pyramid small group model. One guy has a small group of 5-10 guys who each have a small group of 5-10 guys and so on. Everyone, even the gas station attendant, is getting reached by someone. We've seen it to be effective in evangelism, discipleship, retaining, and raising up future leaders.
33. Tamara (from Canada) said the following at 3:16 PM on Jun 19:
Leah (#22) asks:
"Tamara, the way you described your church, what makes it one church and not a network of several churches?"
The main thing being one senior pastor and elder board for all campuses - so the same leadership for it all. Also, while each service feels a little different based on the people who attend, all services have the same special music and the same message (preached by the same pastor, sometimes lives, sometimes via video, it changes depending on the weekend where it's lives and where it's by video), and all tithes/offerings go into one church budget, not a seperate one for each location. A network of churches would still have some degree of independent leadership and financial decisions, and most likely each church would have it's own senior pastor; whereas, at my church this is all combined in one for all the locations/services.
34. LP said the following at 7:46 AM on Jun 21:
My husband and I attend a large church (though not a mega church) that comes from an Anglican liturgical tradition. It's interesting to see the generational spread from the elderly to the single college and seminary students. The absence of modern worship music doesn't seem to inhibit the younger generations from coming and getting involved, and it certainly doesn't scare off the older generations either.
We enjoy being a part of a diverse community that worships in a manner used for hundreds of years, and based firmly in traditions that have lasted throughout Christian history. That's something that can appeal to all ages.
35. Paul said the following at 8:34 AM on Jun 22:
I attend a large church (Sunday attendances of around 1000-1100 across 3 services, 2000+ in the computers) that seems to be on the cusp of a transition into mega church status.
In part this transition is due to some awesome works of God's spirit in our midst. Another part is the many years of faithful prayer, petition and ministry for God that has been sowed into our church by its members. Another part is that we soon intend on building a new physical site for the church, after having well and truly outgrown our current facilities. Like Christopher's (#25) old church, ours has been renovated to more than twice its original size, and now we've outgrown that, too, so we've bought land and in God's time we intend to build. The most important part, however, and the part that will in many ways make or break the transition, is our focus on God and what he's saying to us.
Our congregation is somewhat segregated, unfortunately. Most of the older members and families attend the morning services, and the majority of the youth and young adults attend the evening service. The worship styles in these services is similar, but over many years has been ever so slightly geared to the congregations. Ironically, the music in the morning services is usually louder (yes, I’m serious), because the morning guitarists and drummers, people of great skill and many years service, are slowly going deaf, and so turn their instruments up, making the problem worse! That said, I suspect that our skilled worship team that leads the congregation in contemporary worship is a big drawcard.
Interestingly, a large part of our strong young adults ministry consists of people who have grown up through the strong youth ministries, which are also thriving at our church. I didn’t grow up in these ministries, so I don’t really know why they are doing so well.
We do have the state’s largest uni campus a few miles away, too. No small factor that a fair bit has to be planned around.
Something I found very interesting, when it was mentioned this week in service; only 30% of our young adults attend home groups. The norm that the church is aiming for is more like 70% to accommodate for new people, people in transition, etc. For me, this would be a much more interesting statistic to compare mega churches against others, as I suspect that larger churches do lend themselves to the anonymity that can be, at times, so detrimental to Christian growth.
In terms of the other topics discussed here, mentoring is only active where people seek it out. Exclusive cliques, while having dropped, are still somewhat present. Interestingly, I don’t think seeking a mate is as much of a primary reason why people come, though I do think good fellowship with believers is a big drawcard. I had 4 different dinners (that I know of) that I could have gone to after church this Sunday, each with a reasonable number of mainly single people. As social butterflies will know, to the lonely this might sound like bliss, but it has its own problems, and you can still be lonely while surrounded by many people. To sum a lot of this up, I would characterise us as a church where God is active, the congregation is growing, and we are having some of the growing pains that come with that.
Finally, in reviewing this post before I submitted it, I wondered whether in some ways we’re missing the point. Yes, we need the body to be living, active, vibrant and connected (1 Corinthians 12) in whatever shape that takes. More than that though, Jesus prayed for us all to be united. (John 17) His parting instruction to us was one of commission. (Matthew 28) Perhaps we can look at our church bodies in the light of those callings, regardless of size.
36. Jeni said the following at 1:17 PM on Jun 22:
I attend a large group. It's probably even a mega-church. I like the worship. I like the senior pastor. I like the variety of small groups and ways to get involved. And I like the potential of meeting a variety of people.
The chruch I attend does have young families, a lot of youth, a lot of children, older couples and supposably there ought to be a bunch of singles in attendance as well. I do attend a "young professionals" group (singles & married, with and without children ages 25-40ish), however the group hasn't been attracting a vast amount of singles, so I'm not convinced that there are a lot of singles in attendance at my church. But maybe they prefer to just attend the Sunday morning service and not get involved in small groups.
It has been hard to find a mentor, but I wonder if that is more a product of our times rather than a product of the mega-church.
37. Liz said the following at 2:43 PM on Jun 22:
I attend a medium-sized Episcopal church--definitely not a megachurch. We have a thriving youth program (I'm a leader) and most of the 20-30something singles that I'm friends with are involved in leadership too. I love the liturgical tradition of the services (they are almost identical to Catholic Mass), so I don't think I'd ever attend a megachurch for the worship style. However, I occasionally attend a huge, non-denominational church's young adult program with my sister--it's a fun way to meet others and celebrate God in a different way.