Another Look at Celibacy by Steve Watters on 09/22/2008 at 9:37 AM

Dennis Prager spoke at Focus on the Family last Friday. One of the points he made was that the emphasis of God's work on the second day of creation was in separating. He explained that in the Hebrew, the word for "separate" is the same as the word for "holy." That's why holiness has historically had a context of being set apart and distinct.

Just before going to hear Prager speak, I read a new article in Christianity Today by Marcy Hintz called Choosing Celibacy. That article made an interesting point about how Christian singles can be separate or set apart. Too often, the books and articles I read about Christian singleness seem to seek some kind of hybrid between the single culture we know today and the concepts Paul wrote about two thousand years ago to the church in Corinth.

Unfortunately, those hybrids often seem to err more on the side of accommodating the single culture we know than they do on wrestling with the implications of the fully dedicated celibate life that Paul describes in the book of Corinthians. As a result, we now have a Christian subculture  of Paul (and Pauline) the Playboys who wrap their singleness in Paul's statement "it's better not to marry," but then fail to live out the kind of "dedicated devotion" that would distinguish them from their secular peers.

Hintz appears to be seeking a more distinctive life as a Christian single. She writes:

Why not call for a vowed, vocational commitment to the church? What would change in our culture of singleness if the church were to reclaim a tradition that reinvokes the memory that we live in the time between the gospel's first announcement and its final fulfillment—a time in which marriage is celebrated, but celibacy is held out as a radical sign of fidelity to Christ and his body?
...
Though some churches may flinch from ordaining a celibate vow, we might still use the word celibacy to rightly honor and rightly name the countercultural life to which singles are called. In doing so, we encourage more than just abstinence from sex. We bless the single vocation. We recall the church's history and remember our true family. We christen singles as called-out ones, with familial gifts that amplify the church and her outward-looking mission.

The valuable point Hintz stirs up is that the Protestant community does not provide a formal path for the kind of dedicated and set apart single living that Paul describes. That's of great disadvantage for men and women who truly feel called to celibacy. It's also a reminder that celibacy is quite different from just being single. When Paul said "I wish you were as I am," he meant much more than just his marital status. He meant a life entirely distinct and set apart from the culture of his day for God's service. 

Hintz hints, however, at the difficulty she has faced in promoting celibacy as way for Christian singles to be set apart:

Midway through the discussion series, I met one of my best single friends for lunch. After effusing for a half-hour on the overall energy of the class, I turned to her and asked, "How do you think about your singleness?"

My friend is not passive. She's an artist, she's a leader, and her eyes wear the look of someone who sees into the world with meaning. But on this occasion, her eyes looked down. When she raised them, they were skimmed with tears. "I want to be married," she said, and then looked down again.

I appreciate that Hintz included this anecdote because it's a reminder that many men and women who are single do not feel called to celibacy and would very much like to be married. For Christians who know they should be set apart but believe they are called to marriage, the more helpful context is the one Hintz touches on later in the article when she writes, "While chastity binds married couples to a shared intimacy and singles to refrain from sex, both callings are self-sacrificing as well as self-giving, and both rise from an engagement of love and of faith."

"Chastity" is a calling for both the Christian single who will eventually marry and the one who vows to forgo the blessings of Christian marriage for undivided devotion to God in celibacy. This distinction is key because it's a reminder that while all Christian singles are called to be distinctly set apart from the world, only a few are called to sacrifice marriage permanently as a demonstration of that holy distinction. 

Another Look at Celibacy by Steve Watters on 09/22/2008 at 9:37 AM

Dennis Prager spoke at Focus on the Family last Friday. One of the points he made was that the emphasis of God's work on the second day of creation was in separating. He explained that in the Hebrew, the word for "separate" is the same as the word for "holy." That's why holiness has historically had a context of being set apart and distinct.

Just before going to hear Prager speak, I read a new article in Christianity Today by Marcy Hintz called Choosing Celibacy. That article made an interesting point about how Christian singles can be separate or set apart. Too often, the books and articles I read about Christian singleness seem to seek some kind of hybrid between the single culture we know today and the concepts Paul wrote about two thousand years ago to the church in Corinth.

Unfortunately, those hybrids often seem to err more on the side of accommodating the single culture we know than they do on wrestling with the implications of the fully dedicated celibate life that Paul describes in the book of Corinthians. As a result, we now have a Christian subculture  of Paul (and Pauline) the Playboys who wrap their singleness in Paul's statement "it's better not to marry," but then fail to live out the kind of "dedicated devotion" that would distinguish them from their secular peers.

Hintz appears to be seeking a more distinctive life as a Christian single. She writes:

Why not call for a vowed, vocational commitment to the church? What would change in our culture of singleness if the church were to reclaim a tradition that reinvokes the memory that we live in the time between the gospel's first announcement and its final fulfillment—a time in which marriage is celebrated, but celibacy is held out as a radical sign of fidelity to Christ and his body?
...
Though some churches may flinch from ordaining a celibate vow, we might still use the word celibacy to rightly honor and rightly name the countercultural life to which singles are called. In doing so, we encourage more than just abstinence from sex. We bless the single vocation. We recall the church's history and remember our true family. We christen singles as called-out ones, with familial gifts that amplify the church and her outward-looking mission.

The valuable point Hintz stirs up is that the Protestant community does not provide a formal path for the kind of dedicated and set apart single living that Paul describes. That's of great disadvantage for men and women who truly feel called to celibacy. It's also a reminder that celibacy is quite different from just being single. When Paul said "I wish you were as I am," he meant much more than just his marital status. He meant a life entirely distinct and set apart from the culture of his day for God's service. 

Hintz hints, however, at the difficulty she has faced in promoting celibacy as way for Christian singles to be set apart:

Midway through the discussion series, I met one of my best single friends for lunch. After effusing for a half-hour on the overall energy of the class, I turned to her and asked, "How do you think about your singleness?"

My friend is not passive. She's an artist, she's a leader, and her eyes wear the look of someone who sees into the world with meaning. But on this occasion, her eyes looked down. When she raised them, they were skimmed with tears. "I want to be married," she said, and then looked down again.

I appreciate that Hintz included this anecdote because it's a reminder that many men and women who are single do not feel called to celibacy and would very much like to be married. For Christians who know they should be set apart but believe they are called to marriage, the more helpful context is the one Hintz touches on later in the article when she writes, "While chastity binds married couples to a shared intimacy and singles to refrain from sex, both callings are self-sacrificing as well as self-giving, and both rise from an engagement of love and of faith."

"Chastity" is a calling for both the Christian single who will eventually marry and the one who vows to forgo the blessings of Christian marriage for undivided devotion to God in celibacy. This distinction is key because it's a reminder that while all Christian singles are called to be distinctly set apart from the world, only a few are called to sacrifice marriage permanently as a demonstration of that holy distinction. 

Comments

[1. Carrie (the original) said the following at 9:51 AM on Sep 22:]

1

I've said it once, but I'll say it again: read Lauren Winner's "Real Sex: The Naked Truth About Chastity".

I'm glad that I have a pastor who understands my dilemma. Just because I want to have sex doesn't excuse me from behaving chastely. You can still set yourself apart doesn't mean that you ignore some aspect of your humanity.
Sex within the bounds of marriage: good.
Unchaste behavior: bad.

[2. obewan said the following at 10:17 AM on Sep 22:]

2

The OP said:
>>"...while all Christian singles are called to be distinctly set apart from the world, only a few are called to sacrifice marriage permanently as a demonstration of that holy distinction."<<
-------------------------------------
While I understand the distinction between the two, I continue to struggle with the word "permanent".

How long must singles who want to be married wait before they are to be placed into the "permanent celibate" slot? And, why should the "permanent celibate" label enable someone who is currently single to better serve? Shouldn't singles already be serving? And finally, how permanent is "permanent"? Are singles that would renege and marry in old age then cheaters? I mean, I have heard a lot of stories about priests who eventually fell in love and married - even in old age. Some of them married widows etc...

[3. Adam said the following at 10:37 AM on Sep 22:]

3

I think this idea of being "Celibate" is a small step in the right direction.
I appreciate that Boundless has published a blog that tries to put a slightly more positive spin on being single.

It seems as if being single is largely considered to be a transitive state in between adolescence and adulthood that is to be ended as soon as possible. We are encouraged to
"Get Married". A guy who is seen to be embracing the joys of singlehood is viewed as living in "Guyland".

It would be interesting to see what would happen if singleness was embraced and celebrated in the way that marriage is (not the ceremony, but rather the state of being). Perhaps if it were, some salve towards the pain and frustration of singlehood would be applied.

[4. Carrie (the original) said the following at 10:41 AM on Sep 22:]

4

"How long must singles who want to be married wait before they are to be placed into the "permanent celibate" slot?"

If they enter heaven's gates and never married, they earned the "permanent celibate" slot.
I think we should only define time when and how God does. We can say something is permanent, but then we have to eat our words when it changes 3 days, 3 months, or 3 years down the line.

[5. Matt from DC said the following at 10:58 AM on Sep 22:]

5

"How long must singles who want to be married wait before they are to be placed into the "permanent celibate" slot?"

Until they die.

"And, why should the "permanent celibate" label enable someone who is currently single to better serve?"

Here is how the apostle Paul answers this question:

1 Cor 7:32-35

32I would like you to be free from concern. An unmarried man is concerned about the Lord's affairs—how he can please the Lord. 33But a married man is concerned about the affairs of this world—how he can please his wife— 34and his interests are divided. An unmarried woman or virgin is concerned about the Lord's affairs: Her aim is to be devoted to the Lord in both body and spirit. But a married woman is concerned about the affairs of this world—how she can please her husband. 35I am saying this for your own good, not to restrict you, but that you may live in a right way in undivided devotion to the Lord.

"Shouldn't singles already be serving?"
Of course.

"And finally, how permanent is "permanent"?"
Very.

"Are singles that would renege and marry in old age then cheaters?"
No, but they aren't permanently celibate, either.

[6. mary kate said the following at 11:38 AM on Sep 22:]

6

i've been thinking a lot more about this stuff lately, as i picked up and re-read "passion and purity" by elisabeth elliot. i encourage all singles to read it, multiple times if you can :)

i've been single for 10 years (minus about 3 months of a relationship). i know that i will be married someday. but, today, i am single.

p&p reminded me that what is most important is living god's way, and, like the article says, chastity/celibacy means a lot more than just that i'm not sleeping with anyone. it means living my life according to god's standards of purity. is it difficult? yes, especially after some of the choices i've made in the past. but is it worth it? oh yeah. totally. i'm not in a relationship, but i already see the benefits of bending my life/myself to meet god's standards.

i'm not so sure about the vows thing. to me it's more about daily bread. i don't know how much longer i'll be single. but i know that i am right where i need to be today. tomorrow can worry about itself.

[7. obewan said the following at 12:25 PM on Sep 22:]

7

Matt:

I appreciate your scripture reference, but my take on it is that 1 Cor 7:32-35 should be applied by all singles, not just those who are "permenantly celibate." I mean it keeps me going when I get down in the mouth about not having met Miss. Right yet.

[8. Holly (the married, parent one) said the following at 12:27 PM on Sep 22:]

8

"Chastity" is a calling for both the Christian single who will eventually marry and the one who vows to forgo the blessings of Christian marriage for undivided devotion to God in celibacy.

I would submit to you that chastity is not an un-married person's calling, rather a believer's calling. Of course chastity looks different for a married believer than a single believer, but it is every bit as important. As a married woman, chastity for me is faithfulness to my marital vows and modesty outside of them. Chastity means I don't dress provocatively outside of my bedroom and I don't' seek attention from other men.

Chastity is not temporary (unlike its cousin celibacy), it will just look different in different seasons of life.

[9. Anonymous said the following at 1:31 PM on Sep 22:]

9

Debbie Maken, would you care to weigh in if you've read the post? :-) I'm curious about your perspective.

[10. Aurora said the following at 1:33 PM on Sep 22:]

10

The celibacy question always raises fear in the hearts of singles. It's the fear we have that God will ask us to do the one thing we don't want to do -- remain single, without opportunity to enjoy all the benefits of marriage, include a healthy, God-centered sex life. A pastor I heard once said that if you have to work at maintaining your purity, chances are good you don't have the gift of celibacy or the gift of singleness and that you should expect to get married at some point in your life. Or God would remove the urge/need to couple and would give a contentment/satisfaction in life as a single person. If you aren't gifted with singleness, you then had/have the responsibility of living a life worthy of Christ -- living a life of chastity until such time as you were given in marriage. I think some singles are so fearful that marriage won't come that any hint that we might have to "stay this way forever" is just frightening. Chalk one up for the enemy when we choose to listen to his fear-mongering and not trust the God who loves us and cares deeply about our hopes and dreams.

[11. Kevin said the following at 1:47 PM on Sep 22:]

11

"...feel called to celibacy...,...life to which singles are called...,...as called-out ones...,...do not feel called to celibacy...,...believe they are called to marriage...,...'Chastity' is a calling...,...only a few are called to sacrifice marriage..."

Ok, so what do we do if we don't know what we're being 'called' to? What if we've never heard God or felt God call us to anything? What if we've been praying constantly and reading the entire bible through and crying out to God for well over a year for truth and clarity and to know what God wants us to do and haven't felt God call us at all? What then?

[12. Tami said the following at 2:32 PM on Sep 22:]

12

Amen, Aurora (10).

I am neither a freak, nor forsaken by God, because I am not yet married.

And, God hears my prayers... He alone knows me well enough to give me the right gift, at the right time.

What I need to do is, pray and affirm this: I will not be frightened by any fear. And I hear married women need to do this, too [1 Peter 3:5-6] :)

[13. Adam said the following at 2:42 PM on Sep 22:]

13

Steve,

Are you saying that "undistracted devotion" to the Lord" refers to some kind of service to God in terms of the church or gospel service? Can you give me any lexical sources for your interpretation of this term in this fashion?

In fact, this is a rejection of the protestant teaching on vocation. Here is an interesting article from a Lutheran Seminary discussing Luther's view of vocation to document that very fact:

http://www.luthersem.edu/word&world/Archives/3-4_Luther/3-4_Kolden.pdf

Luther believed that wherever we are at in life, we are to serve God. Battling the sinful nature, and putting to death the desires of the flesh. Also, growing in holiness and in wisdom in all areas of life, including our job, family, and church relationships is part of the protestant concept of vocation. This is what I believe "undestracted devotion" is referring to in this passage.

What Paul is saying here is that a married person has a more difficult time with this because of the fact that they have divided interests. Often times, one can have one's concerns for their wife get in the way of one's devotion to the Lord. Not that it must be that way, but we in our flesh tend to make it that way. Expecially in the context of the "present distress [v.26]," when you can focus on the safety of your family so much, that you forget for whom you are ultimately taking care of your family. What Paul is saying is that, if you are single, you do not have these distractions, and can pursue complete devotion to God without them.

When Paul said "I wish you were as I am," he meant much more than just his marital status. He meant a life entirely distinct and set apart from the culture of his day for God's service.

Actually, that didn't mean "a life entirely distinct and set apart from the culture of his day for God's service." The only thing being discussed in the passage is marital status. Where, specifically, is all of the rest of that in this in 1 Corinthians 7:1-6?

While I agree that there may be many singles out there who are, indeed, single and immature, ungodly, etc., the problem is with their *immaturity,* not their marital status. Once they turn their lives around, and live their life after Christ, whether they are in gospel/church ministry or not, they will have this "undistracted devotion" Paul is talking about here.

God Bless,
Adam

[14. Sarah P. said the following at 3:08 PM on Sep 22:]

14

Kevin (#11) says: Ok, so what do we do if we don't know what we're being 'called' to? . . .

I hear you. I struggled and struggled with this at one particularly painful time of life. God doesn't usually thunder to us down from Heaven and say, "Here is my point by point plan for your life." But He does talk to us. His words are written down in the Bible, and the Holy Spirit illuminates them to us. That is how we hear Him -- not in the storm of feelings, but in the still, quiet, difficult, written truth. Some truths:

- God will never leave us nor forsake us.
- God does not "punish" us because we "mess up" (Heb. 12-13). In fact, He all things will work together for our good (i.e., Christ-likeness). And when we do something stupid that faces earthly repercussions now, we can rejoice in that suffering, because it produces patience, experience, and hope.
- We are completely, utterly, free from the law.
- In short, we can do and try anything, and only fear stands in the way! And perfect love casts out fear. We can do all things through Christ which strengthens us.

Aurora (#10) says: The celibacy question always raises fear in the hearts of singles. It's the fear we have that God will ask us to do the one thing we don't want to do -- remain single, without opportunity to enjoy all the benefits of marriage, include a healthy, God-centered sex life.

God asks us to live one day at a time and not to be anxious for what will happen tomorrow. What is my calling? It is to do the best with what I can, right now, today, and leave the rest to His grace.

I think the problem I have with that description of the "call to celibacy," Aurora, is that you can apply the same argument to any number of things, including alcoholism. "If I wasn't supposed to be an alcoholic, God would remove the urge to drink." Hmm. I know, like Carrie, I feel the sex urge now. Yet I am single, and who knows for how long, or if I will walk to the end of my life and look back and find myself still single?

Right now, this is my calling: To turn my loneliness into solitude. And yes, to trust God enough to be purposeful with this time and believe that I am not big enough to destroy His purpose for my life.

[15. mary kate said the following at 3:19 PM on Sep 22:]

15

kevin #11:
Stop seeking answers and start seeking HIM. just spend time with him. do you believe He'll tell you? ok, then relax. He'll tell you. read the bible through just to learn about him and be with him, not to get answers. which do you want more: answers and gifts, or an amazing relationship with the giver?

[16. Christina (in green) said the following at 3:49 PM on Sep 22:]

16

Kevin (#11)
Ok, so what do we do if we don't know what we're being 'called' to?

PRAY

What if we've never heard God or felt God call us to anything?

PRAY SOME MORE

Pray in the Spirit at all times and on every occasion. Stay alert and be persistent in your prayers for all believers everywhere.
-Ephesians 6:18

And you are one of the believers everywhere ;)

[17. Laura said the following at 6:36 PM on Sep 22:]

17

Kevin, and others who've responded to him: figuring out the will of God is not about waiting for someone to come along and say, "Thus sayeth the Lord." It's not about a "still, small voice" or some mystical gut feeling or "leading."

For most Christians and most circumstances, it's about two things: wisdom and faithfulness. Be wise in the choices you make, and be faithful with what God has already given you.

What's before you? What are you good at? What life experiences do you have? Where do those things naturally take you?

Don't wait around for another year for the Lord to give you some kind of a sign. He's revealed everything you need in his Word -- both his written word and the living Word, Jesus. You're not less of a Christian because you haven't heard the audible voice of God telling you where to go to college or what job to get or what girl to marry. Ecclesiastes 9:10 -- Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might. In other words, go! Get up, look around, put your hand to the plow and don't look back. God is sovereign, and his plans will prevail whether you go to college A or B, take this job or that one, or marry Susie or Mary. Do whatever God has put before you! And trust that his purposes will be accomplished as you step out in faith.

Blessings!

[18. Leah said the following at 7:01 PM on Sep 22:]

18

Obewan, I think (and Steve, correct me if I'm wrong) that the label of "permanently celibate" only applies to a person who chooses it for themselves. They choose to be celibate for life, and so they should carry out a celibate life of dedication to God.

Those who want to be married though, will never (and should never) think that they are, or will end up, "permanently celibate". Because they want to be married! I think it's that simple.

Kevin- try not to get all super-spiritual. Just ask yourself. "Do I want to get married?" Don't interrupt that question with things like "but what if God wants me to be single"- God will not place a desire for marriage within you if he wants you to be single. So all you need do is ask yourself, "do I want to get married?" If you do, then there's your answer. If you don't, and honestly think you could maintain a life of celibacy, there's your answer :)

[19. Max S said the following at 7:52 PM on Sep 22:]

19

Sarah P (#14) wrote:
> "I think the problem I have with
> that description of the "call to
> celibacy," Aurora, is that you can
> apply the same argument to any
> number of things, including
> alcoholism. "If I wasn't supposed
> to be an alcoholic, God would
> remove the urge to drink." "

I couldn't agree more. The idea that only those without sexual attraction have the gift of singleness presumes that virtue should always be easy and that God will fulfill all our desires in this life. Neither is biblical or true to life. Sometimes God wants us to struggle and wait.

[20. Rachael said the following at 8:30 PM on Sep 22:]

20

Kevin,

If you're praying and in the Word, perhaps you can just follow your heart and take advantage of the opportunities presented before you, provided doing so doesn't run contrary to Scripture.

God is more powerful than your decisions. What if you make the 'wrong' decision? God can still work through it. He can stop you.

A lot of what God wants of us is revealed through Scripture. Sure our particularly situation specifics aren't perfectly spelled out. But a lot of what God wants is clear. Beyond that, I'd say, make a decision and go for it. I should apply the last decision to myself as well.

God doesn't have to make things clear or unclear to us, but I recently prayed to God that if He not want (a circumstance that may happen) to make that very clear in the very near future. If He doesn't, I'll probably just make the decision. And if that's the wrong decision? Hopefully He'll make it clear after I make the decision before 'it's too late'.

At some point we just have to decide things and move forward...

[21. Kevin said the following at 8:05 AM on Sep 23:]

21

Pray? That's your answer? Maybe you didn't catch that part of my post, I DO pray. I pray a lot. I pray hard. How can I have an 'amazing' relationship with God when I'll pray things like, "God, I'm here. Do with me as you like. Lead me to do your will. Show me your plan for me. Know me. Help me to know you. Teach me. etc," and yet I'll still hear/feel nothing?

Jesus didn't instruct his listeners to "have an amazing relaionship with God." He said, "Do the will of my Father," and "love eachother as I have loved you."

I want to do the will of God, and I ask to do it. But I don't know what that will is. People will say they feel God calling them to do something, I hear it all the time. But I wonder if God is REALLY calling them to do something, or if they are just pinning Him onto something they think might be good. They hear all the other people in their church or youth group saying, "God called me to this and that and the other thing." So in order to keep from feeling left out they pick something they think is good or something that's convenient for them and say, "God called me to do this," in order to keep from feeling left out. It gives them security and makes them feel more comfortable with themselves. They say, "God put this on my heart." How do we know God really put it there? How do we know it's not just our mind putting it there? Mohammed believed Gabriel put the Quran in his heart. Joseph Smith, Jr. believed Moroni put the translation of the book of Mormon in his heart. The councils of Carthage, Rome and Trent all believed God put the true biblical canon in their hearts. Obviously, at least some of these people were mistaken.

I don't want to just think I'm being called to something, I want to know. But I don't know. I don't have a clue. And despite seeking it and asking for it for a very long time, not for my own sake, but so that God may be gorified, I haven't found it or received it. Have I been damned or something? Am I the only one in this boat? Are there others who feel the same way I do and are just too scared to admit it to themselves? Is there anyone who can offer more help than merely telling me to do what I'm already doing?

note: keep in mind that I AM (and have been) asking God for help and trusting in Him.

[22. Nickolina said the following at 8:14 AM on Sep 23:]

22

I became a Christian at 20, was sexually active & sporadically engaged at the time, and struggled with the whole celibacy idea for years. Not a struggle of intellect or conviction; a struggle of awakened desires that would not go back to sleep once I chose to be chaste!

I kept putting my desires to be married on the altar, & there are lots of tears in that statement. I asked God not to allow me to be married until I could be a real "helpmeet" and He kept closing the door to marriage in my pleading face for 10 years.

Now, I have been married for 25 years and can share a couple of points--

Both states, married or single, are referred to as "gifts" by Jesus. All gifts are given for the benefit of the Body of Christ and are not necessarily for the rest of your stay on earth. People die all the time, and that will include you or a spouse and could happen today. (Excellent motivation, by the way, to appreciate what God gives you every moment.)

Both states, married or single, require being dead to self and alive to Christ. If you aren't struggling with something being put on the altar, you aren't sharing His suffering or growing in His grace. Your sin nature is not compatible with anyone else's and marriage does not mean constant fulfillment.

Both states, married or single, are actually temporary because there is only one marriage in Heaven, that of Christ & His Bride... which includes you if you choose.

Both states, married or single, are dim reflections of eternity and are going to be baffling with times of blindness. This means you walk by faith and not by sight.

Learning to be content in whatever state you are in requires knowing God & His Word, which is true theology. Only truth sets us free, and He is Truth.

Theology isn't an intellectual exercise, it is knowing God & interacting with Him--"God-Logic", that which makes sense (ology=the study of) because of God (theos=God). The hidden choices you make in response to Him every day are where you serve, married or single.

[23. mary kate said the following at 9:09 AM on Sep 23:]

23

WONDERFUL post, nickolina! very encouraging and full of truth. thank you for sharing.

i have also had to put desires for marriage on the altar, almost daily! and yeah, a lot of times with a lot of tears. but the peace and joy that come from totally giving those desires to god are soooo worth it! now he's in control, and i don't worry about marriage anymore. i don't have to.

[24. Matt from DC said the following at 9:23 AM on Sep 23:]

24

Kevin,

If I may be so bold, I am going to say that prayer is not necessary at this point because God has spoken in His Word. I trust that you were honest when you wrote "...reading the entire bible through..." so I'll only provide you with summary and books/chapters to explain what the Bible has to say about marriage.

When God first created man he was alone and though morally perfect he lacked completeness. Adam needed a helper so God created Eve to this end to compliment Adam in every way - equal in worth, but different in role. This complimentary union that is rooted in creation and lived out through marriage. God made mankind two genders to be united for his glory in marriage. - Genesis 1-2.

Later, God sent a flood as judgment on mankind and all were killed except for eight people - Noah, his wife, their three sons, and their wives. When the flood had receded and Noah and family were out of the ark God reiterated the covenant that He made with Adam to Noah affirming his design for man and woman to marry. - Genesis 9.

To this day all of mankind is under the covenant that God made with our forefather Noah.

When Jesus came preaching and teaching he set the example of a single man dedicated to doing the will of the Father. This raised some obvious questions for early believers and Paul responds to them in 1 Corinthians. Also, in his first letter to Timothy about how to pastor, Paul includes instruction about marriage in light of the New Covenant. Even though there is a gifting that allows for a person to remain contentedly single all of his/her life it is not given to all.

Unless you know you have the gift of singleness (and it sounds like you don't) you're under the covenant given to Noah and you're designed to marry. Just like every day you have breath you're designed to glorify God.

Remember that you will never be alone because Jesus will be with you. From the moment you believed you were filled with the Holy Spirit and Jesus and the Father have come and made their home with you (John 14). You are well equipped. Not only did Jesus' work reconcile God and man, but also Jesus purchased from every tribe and tongue a people of his own - the church. He died that you could come to know Him, that your sin debt would be paid in full, and so that you would be adopted into His family. Are you involved in a local church? Are you serving according to your spiritual gifting? Are you part of that community of sanctified ones who have been called out of the world to a heavenly country? I hope you are. Finally, if you feel fear and anxiety and are not convicted of sin then it is the work of the enemy. Pay it no mind, pray to be strengthened from it, and keep on going. Do not despair because God does not act how and when you want. Know that when He acts and how He chooses to do so will always be the best whether it makes sense to us while it is happening does not matter.

[25. mary kate said the following at 9:25 AM on Sep 23:]

25

kevin....
i'm sorry. many of us, myself included, responded to with what may have felt like flippant, cure-all answers. pray! seek god!

yeah, you are doing those things. all i can say is that i agonized thru 'just tell me what to do! i will do whatever you want me to!!' types of questions for years, in reference to both wanting to be married and wanting a more fulfilling job.

i've been at the ad agency i work at for five years... since i started, i knew it was not what i wanted to do forever. i have tons of pages in my journals where i am crying out to god (and the pages are stained with tears) to tell me how to figure out what i should be doing. go back to school? work at another agency? work at starbucks? i couldn't understand why he wouldn't help me figure out what to do. i was putting myself in front of him, asking for answers, and saying, whatever the answers are, i'll take them!

after a lot of crying out, i was tired. and finally i felt like he was saying 'relax. seriously. you know i have a plan for you... my word tells you so. so just be with me, spend time with me, and know that i love you and will reveal things to you when the time is right. i think god sometimes just wants us to enjoy Him, enjoy being with him, instead of just wanting him to give us answers all the time.

so i relaxed, and focused on what he had given me; the job i have, the friends i have, the life i have. i made myself be content. and i started to feel a lot better.

and after a while of being content, and some time away on a mission trip to new orleans, i got what i'd been asking for; strong direction from god on where to go next. i'm probably quitting my job in january to go back to school to become an art teacher. in a few minutes, i'm leaving work to meet with an advisor at the school i'll go to. i'm soooo freaking excited!!!!!

obviously, that's an abridged version of how the last several years have been. feel free to contact me (click my name, it links to my blog) if you want to hear more.

hang in there. he will tell you! and when he does, you'll know. and unlike joseph smith et al, you'll know because you'll be able to back up what god is saying with scripture and your community of believers. think of it like a stool; your mission/your life needs to be supported by answers to prayer, scripture, and what solid believers who are close to you are saying. a stool needs three legs to be supported; just one or two, and it falls over. make sense?

praying for you!!!

[26. Tami said the following at 9:51 AM on Sep 23:]

26

I actually do see a flaw in Sarah P's analogy (14):

"If I wasn't supposed to be married, then God wouldn't have given me these desires" -- to me, this sounds like a prompt to seek God for what good gifts He desires to give. (I am assuming this person is also in obedience to God's will regarding living chastely NOW.)

"If I wasn't supposed to be an alcoholic, God would remove the urge to drink" -- this sounds like an attempt to excuse one's own sin. Alternately, it sounds fatalistic about one's propensity towards alcoholism.

Certainly, we can't always predict what God wants to give us. But I think we are obliged to seek what He would deem good for us. And yes, sometimes it is for us to wait. But those who desire marriage shouldn't lose hope, nor should they cease praying, simply because God might *not* answer in the exact way they hope or anticipate at the moment.

[27. Nickolina said the following at 10:01 AM on Sep 23:]

27

God's blindingly illuminating will....

I identify with Kevin! It would be so much easier to have GOD'S WILL lowered from heaven on a huge piece of paper, dangling from a fish hook like the old "Charlie Tuna" commercials (I reveal my age)...and I have done the coin toss to decide waaay too many things in my life, hoping it was sorta kinda like casting the lots in the OT.

It is hugely comforting to read in Scripture things like, "Who is so blind as Thy servant?" and "We are crushed, but not despairing...etc." He knows we are but dust, like Hobbits caught up in things beyond our Shire.

In my limited experience, I've seen that if I don't do His Will in the things I already know He wants my obedience in, being patient, trusting Him, forgiving someone, listening rather than planning my mini-sermon...then I have a harder time seeing His will in a choice.

What I generally do when facing a huge decision is pray for wisdom, choose what looks wisest, & ask God to close the door if it's not best. And I still have doubts afterward...but I must trust Him that if I was willing to hear His "NO" it was His "YES".

When you look at the history of His people, most of us wander around ignorant of His presence except for flashes of insight but that doesn't mean He's not there. Look at how Israel, despite the pillar of fire & cloud, complained in the wilderness!

I do that.

[28. IMO said the following at 12:09 PM on Sep 23:]

28

Nickolina-
It seems you would make a wonderful mentor to younger women! I hope you consider it (if you aren't already one).

[29. Sarah P. said the following at 12:35 PM on Sep 23:]

29

Kevin (#21) wrote: Pray? That's your answer? Maybe you didn't catch that part of my post, I DO pray. I pray a lot. I pray hard. How can I have an 'amazing' relationship with God when I'll pray things like, "God, I'm here. Do with me as you like. Lead me to do your will. Show me your plan for me. Know me. Help me to know you. Teach me. etc," and yet I'll still hear/feel nothing?

I had to take what would have been the last semester of my senior year off from college in order to go home and help my parents. My best friends graduated without me. It was tough. I went on long walks in the evening, and I spent a lot of time lying on my back in our backyard and crying to God -- asking what you're asking. "Where are you, Lord God? What do you want from me anyway?"

So one day I'm lying there praying this, and I ask, "Jesus, speak to me. Talk to me. I need to hear you!" And I wait, but nothing happens. No words. Except I look up and see the branch of a tree waving over my head. I think, "Who is holding the tree together? Jesus! He is holding it together; He is holding me together (Col. 1:17). That's where He is. He is right here, 'knowing' my every atom." And then I realize, God doesn't have to speak to me in audible words, simply because He already wrote down His words to me long before I was born.

The key item in this story is that God did answer my prayer. He spoke to me right then and there through the working of the Holy Spirit, who pulled the right words from Colossians into my mind in direct answer to my request to hear from God. There wasn't a lot of fanfare. Nothing dramatic. But He spoke, in response to prayer, through the simple medium of Scripture.

I don't know if that helps you. It is true, though. If you read your Bible and seek/pray for wisdom so that the Holy Spirit has something to use, and then pray for guidance, it will come. I guarantee it will come slower than you hope, but it will come.

[30. IMO said the following at 12:37 PM on Sep 23:]

30

"How can I have an 'amazing' relationship with God when I'll pray things like, "God, I'm here. Do with me as you like. Lead me to do your will. Show me your plan for me. Know me. Help me to know you. Teach me. etc," and yet I'll still hear/feel nothing?"

This reminds me of how I used to (and still do) pray for God to change me and make me like Christ...(actually pretty much like your prayer above)
And then I realized that I won't get my answers by "simply" praying about it.
For example, I'd pray for more patience. And instead of just getting patience from God, I'd get into situations throughout the day that would test my patience. God could use those circumstances throughout the day to grow my patience.
Or when I'd pray to be more loving toward others, I'd face hard-to-even-like people throughtout the day.

You get my drift.

If you are praying for God to reveal Himself to you..He has! In His Word. Through His Holy Spirit, which is in you. And through circumstances, difficulties, and trials. Basically, through experiences in life.

"I don't want to just think I'm being called to something, I want to know. But I don't know. I don't have a clue."

Is there something specific that you want to be called to?

I never got a "calling" from God. I don't think that's Biblical to say we'll all get this calling to do this or that.
When I was in college, I hated it. 100%. I REALLY wanted to be called into a ministry or missions to get out of going to school. But nothing happened. I graduated.

God requires us to be obedient to Him in the small things.

"And despite seeking it and asking for it for a very long time, not for my own sake, but so that God may be gorified, I haven't found it or received it. Have I been damned or something?"

I'm sorry, I'm confused by this comment.
What are you seeking?

Are you saying that God will only be glorified if you have found or received it?

Are you saying that you feel damned because God isn't being glorified?

How do you know God is not being glorified already?

[31. Sarah P. said the following at 12:58 PM on Sep 23:]

31

Tami (#26),

Quite possibly there is a flaw in that specific analogy. But I have noticed that sometimes people stay single their whole lives, even if they have strong desires for marriage/sex. I was wrestling with the question, do these people, who have remained celibate their entire lives, have the "gift of celibacy?" If not, then by extension they must have "missed God's will." That doesn't seem possible. Sometimes God even sends whales to swallow people, just to make His will happen. So then, celibacy must mean something else than simply not desiring sex. I like what the CT article says about celibacy being a consistent commitment, just like how marriage is a daily commitment.

[32. Sharlene said the following at 1:06 PM on Sep 23:]

32

Hey Kevin (#21)
I just want to encourage you to keep on praying and seeking. This is exactly what God has called us to do - seek his kingdom and his righteousness - so don't give up. I know that God is pleased with your desire to seek His kingdom and he wants us to come to Him persistently. Don't be discouraged if God doesn't tell you what your specific "calling" is. You already know what he desires – for us to love Him (ie obey His commands) and to love others. I know that when I pray and read the Bible, I am often convicted of my sin, and how I neglect to love Him and others. For example, I recognize that I have been selfishly caught up in my own world while neglecting to love my roommate selflessly while she is going through a tough time. It is through prayer like this that I know what God desires for me to do the next day – to love my roommate. To be honest, I have no idea what God has called me to long term (in a specific sense). Sometimes I struggle with that. But I find peace when I seek God day by day, knowing that even when I make mistakes he forgives me. The Christian walk is not easy, but take heart, it is through this time of hardship that God is molding you into the man of God that he has created you to be. Some passages I have found very helpful are Hebrews 12:1-12, Matthew 7:7-12.

[33. Kevin said the following at 1:38 PM on Sep 23:]

33

Thanks mary kate and Nickolina for being honest. You offered experience and advice that makes sense without making it sound like, "you're just not doing it right, you need to do this and this and this..." You helped, so thanks.

And btw, mary kate, I'm also from the midwest, a city. But sorry, I don't play much volleyball. ;)

[34. mary kate said the following at 1:52 PM on Sep 23:]

34

lol, kev :)

[35. Nickolina said the following at 3:14 PM on Sep 23:]

35

You are welcome, Kevin & thanks for the encouragement, people...

So many times advice begins to feel like it's coming from Job's friends, and that's sad. It's ironic that, at the end of Job when he sees God & that's enough ... he STILL doesn't get an explanation of what was going on. I hope he did when he died, because I'm hoping for explanations when I'm dead, too!

A lot of those dark times we just need to eat something & sleep a while, like Elijah after Mount Carmel when he was suicidal...but if someone told me I needed a snack & a nap when I was in the pit, I'd hit 'em.

[36. Jennifer said the following at 4:26 PM on Sep 23:]

36

Steve,

You've done your readers an incredible disservice by lauding the incoherent gobbledeegook of Marcy Hintz. No wonder Kevin is confused, with quotations like this:

"For Christians who know they should be set apart but believe they are called to marriage the more helpful context is the one Hintz touches on later in the article when she writes, 'While chastity binds married couples to a shared intimacy and singles to refrain from sex, both callings are self-sacrificing as well as self-giving, and both rise from an engagement of love and of faith.'"

What are you (and Hintz) trying to say here? That singles by choice for service are "set apart", or that all believing singles (involuntary ones included) are "set apart"? Because if it's the latter, muddling together all singles (voluntary, involuntary, avowed, circumstantial) in this way, as part of some specially "singled out" group of celibates is not helpful.

Yes, as believers (married or otherwise), we are "set apart". But I think describing all singles in this "set apart" language makes absolutely no sense to a group that too often gets "singled out", being made to feel separate or different from the larger body enough as it is.

Why can't we just stick with a "sola scriptura" approach to singleness? Like Paul and Christ, who spoke entirely in the practical language of choice. Paul in 1 Cor 7 stating the advantages and disadvantages, under what conditions those choices make sense, but making it even more clear that it's no sin what we chose -- and never, ever super-spiritualizing it.

In scripture, there is no "called to celibacy" (or even "called to marriage" for that matter). No "gift of singleness", no "gift of marriage. Singleness itself is never referred to as a calling or vocation (the latter being used to describe occupation or mission), marriage never something you have to wait to be "called to".

This does not mean that God's sovereign will is not at work. It simply means we are to use good sense in exercising the volition that God has given us vis a vis marriage and singleness, considering the gifts he has given us (ie. "containment", as per 1 Cor 7:4-9. There's far too much talk about divining God's will for our individual lives and not enough emphasis on simply obeying God's will as per the scriptures.

Having evangelical celibacy vows and hoopla for those single for a "season" or lifetime commitment will not solve the problems singles face in terms of public perceptions or private behavior. No more than teen sex will be solved by father-daughter purity pledges (or father-daughter purity lockets -- ewwww!).

Our good intentions to affirm those who have chosen celibate service should not exist at the expense of the larger number of singles who get understandably confused and anxious when terms like celibate and celibacy get applied to them. Even "chastity" has become convoluted as gets applied to everyone from the married to the avowed celibate to the "reborn virgin". I think abstinent is a better choice of word, when we are talking about obeying teachings about premarital sex -- without marriage, it's a commandment, not a "calling".

It's an unfortunate trend how showy writers like Marcy Hintz and Lauren Winner have been dressing up singleness and celibacy, muddling both together, waxing lyrical while approving academics look on. If Hintz's professor really wanted her to help singles, she would get her mind out of the "set them up for singleness" box and take more seriously the fact that most of that one fifth who never marry are not single by choice. We must stop glossing over these facts and start looking at the consequences.

Hintz complains that "Evangelical pastors justify the celibate life with those passages, but hardly ever promote it as a desirable calling" and suggests that "Though some churches may flinch from ordaining a celibate vow, we might still use the word celibacy to rightly honor and rightly name the countercultural life to which singles are called".

Does she not know that Christ in Matthew 19 reserved his teachings on celibacy only for those who can hear them? Like AA, celibate service as a life choice is something that should be sustained through attraction, not promotion, especially considering the anxiety it creates in those who do not want to be "celibate".

Steve, I apologize if the tone of my post is harsh, but Hintz' writings are a step backward for Boundless and I wish you'd taken a more critical stance. Perhaps you should re-read your wife's book!

[37. Jeremy said the following at 12:13 AM on Sep 24:]

37

Kevin, as way of encouragement, let me offer an insight that took me a long time to realize -- the Christian community uses phrases like God's call, or hearing from God, or God's direction, in ways that are completely unlike how those words would be used in any other context. Almost always, what someone who uses these phrases is referring to is a combination of emotion and opportunity (God led me to the mission field ... because I like missions and there was an organization accepting applications).

You are not missing anything essential! I have never heard the voice of God, I have never had him direct a decision in my life (directly). Indeed, even in Scripture, the record of God's work in human history, it is exceedingly rare for a person to even once in his life hear from God. So don't be discouraged, and don't feel the need to rely on hearing directly from God for decisions. What Scripture calls us to do is live according to God's commands, seek to grow in wisdom for decision making, and take responsibility for our choices.

[38. Rachael said the following at 10:07 AM on Sep 24:]

38

Kevin,

I responded to you in #20, but I'd like to add a bit. Please don't think you're weird for not feeling 'called' or that something might not be 'on your heart'.

Actually, I commend you for questioning things. And can I add that not every Christian everywhere talks like that. I wonder if you'd feel more comfortable in a different church, to be honest. If people around you are constantly talking about being "called" and their feelings, perhaps you'd simply feel more comfortable in another church. Please don't think something's wrong for not feeling so strongly about your "calling". Honestly, I would most likely feel uncomfortable and maybe skeptical if I was in a Christian community where people constantly talked about being "called", "led", and had things on their heart all the time.

I've been in a variety of denominations (including non-denominational) throughout my life, and I can tell you that not every Christian constantly talks like that. I don't. Not at all!!! I don't think I've ever said "I've been called to.........".

Now, many many years ago, probably when I was Jr. High age, I was with a youth group or something in a youth pastor's house. I think we were supposed to go around the room and say what we felt was on our heart or what Jesus was saying to us or something along those lines. If I'm not mistaken, I may have been told something like "It doesn't have to be a big impression or a clear voice" or something. I think I understood that, but I don't think I felt I had something specifically impressed upon my heart. Now, I may have ended up saying something, but if so, I probably just said it to appease and without thinking it was a direct message from God. It's just kind of weird to me how we were expected to be hearing from God or something. Thankfully, we ended up leaving that church and sought to go to a church that was more centered on Biblical teaching.

Sure, God can work in and through churches that are more touchy-feely, why not, but the touchy-feeliness should not overpower Scripture and what we know of God in the Bible.

We can't pigeon-hole God, put Him in a box, whatever you want to call it. We can't assume He'll always tell us "Do this specific thing, do that specific thing."

What we know we're supposed to do is already layed out in Scripture. Sure He can guide and impress stuff on our hearts. But we won't always have special feelings and see stars in the sky pointing to Bethlehem.

Last, here is a short article that starts with the question <"How does a person making decisions know what is the will of God?"

Best!

[39. Tami said the following at 11:27 AM on Sep 24:]

39

Jennifer (35) -- I am totally with you on Hintz's article, but I disagree about Lauren Winner. (I also don't think Steve is exactly advocating Hintz's point, but that's another matter.) Where do you see this in Winner's writing? I ask with genuine curiosity. If she promoted *celibacy* in the same way Hintz does, I would have been equally as turned off.

I've listened to Winner lecture in person a couple times, and have read her books and articles, and never got the sense that she was advocating singleness as a lifestyle choice, per se -- just that we don't view it as either a holding pattern where God has stuck us and left us isolated, or as an opportunity to engage in lustful (non-chaste) behavior.

The only similarity I see between Winner and Hintz is that Winner is trying to portray the unmarried as being as much of a part of the church as the married -- that we are all one body. I see no problem with this. I am unmarried (not by choice) and I am very much a part of my church. Nevertheless, as evidenced here, many others (also unmarried, not by choice) do feel marginalized in their own churches. This, indeed, is something that we have to address as the body: both by making sure *all* members of a church feel welcome, and by creating an atmosphere where marriage is encouraged as a blessing, but not idolized as a special state meant only for the chosen, where families are cordoned off from the not-married.

(As a general comment -- I agree with those who define chastity as a command for *all* believers, but celibacy as a vow or choice *deliberately taken up* by those who wish to serve God unhindered by the particular responsibilities of marriage and family. John Stott is a modern evangelical example of such a person. Agree with him on the particulars or not, you can't argue that he has not fully dedicated his life to Christian service.)

[40. Kevin said the following at 2:09 PM on Sep 24:]

40

Thanks for responding Jeremy and Rachael. I've got a bit to clarify to each of you though.

Jeremy: Emotion and opportunity are dangerous things to attribute to God, ESPECIALLY emotion. Those things can be so manipulated by a person. And a person can be so manipulated by those things. I'm definitely not going to start saying God led me to do something just because I felt emotional and opportunistic about it. That's like stealing God's giant stamp of approval and stamping things that come up that you feel emotionally drawn to. Especially when emotions change every day. I'm pretty sure it says somewhere in the bible that our hearts can deceive us. So if people are really doing as you say they are, then God's will is being controlled merely by people's emotions. And I for one don't trust that at all.

Rachael: "I wonder if you'd feel more comfortable in a different church, to be honest."

Maybe, but I don't go to church to feel comfortable. That's how people get deceived. That's exactly why Joel Osteen's church is so jam packed with thousands of people, they all go there to feel comfortable with themselves. And besides, this issue isn't caused merely by people in churches that I attend. You and I both know that it's a very common theme in the entire realm of christianity. And, I fear it's a theme that stems from the very explaination (emotion and opportunity) that Jeremy gave in #37.

I know we can't put God in a box, and I know that He's probably not gonna speak to me in a big booming voice with answers to all my questions. The thing that frustrates me is that, if He doesn't speak to me like that, how can I know that what I think is His calling really IS His calling, and not just my own emotions? How can I know it's not just my own deceitful heart and mind? I can't. And I'm not going to pin God's name to something just because I feel emotional about it.

[41. Jeremy said the following at 2:33 PM on Sep 24:]

41

Kevin (#40) -

You are exactly right, it is very dangerous; I think "stealing God's stamp of approval" is an excellent way to characterize that. It is sad that this seems to be such a prevalent misuse among many evangelicals, but the fact that you are keeping your focus on Scripture and questioning what might seem to be conventional thinking when it does not line up with God's word is an excellent thing. God bless!

[42. Sarah P. said the following at 3:23 PM on Sep 24:]

42

Kevin: Peace, brother. :)

Ecc. 11:9 - Rejoice, O young man, in thy youth; and let thy heart cheer thee in the days of thy youth, and walk in the ways of thine heart, and in the sight of thine eyes: but know thou, that for all these things God will bring thee into judgment.

What do you fear? What will happen if you go wrong? God will bring you back. There is no way to get through life without falling flat on your face a few times. It hurts. You learn.

I'm a juggler. We say, "Every drop is a sign of progress." That is because you only drop when you are trying things you can't do... yet. And that is what youth is for. :)

[43. Nickolina said the following at 4:00 PM on Sep 24:]

43

#36 said, "In scripture, there is no "called to celibacy" (or even "called to marriage" for that matter). No "gift of singleness", no "gift of marriage."

Matthew 19:11, Jesus says that not all men can accept the statement (better not to marry) but only those to whom it has been given.

Being given something=a gift.

I will grant the stretch in terms of marriage, except that Eve was given to Adam and the whole of Biblical reference to gifts is so compex that teaching on gifts varies according to church culture. It is clear, regardless of your defining of "giftedness", that you are part of the Body of Christ (once born again, as Jesus put it) and that not being obedient to serve Him in your areas of influence & responsibility (He mentioned food service in Matt 24:45) will cause the Body to suffer because you are not doing His will...

This applies to all of us, married or single, slave or free, Jew or Gentile, man or woman.

I agree that the final authority is God's Word.

And it is kind of funny to my warped sense of humor that we get so reactive to words like celibate, chaste, & abstinent when they pretty much mean the same thing.

[44. Leah said the following at 6:22 PM on Sep 24:]

44

Sarah P said I think the problem I have with that description of the "call to celibacy," Aurora, is that you can apply the same argument to any number of things, including alcoholism. "If I wasn't supposed to be an alcoholic, God would remove the urge to drink."

That's faulty reasoning. The key reason is that alcoholism is a sin; celibacy is not. We are all susceptible to sin; some a more susceptible to certain sins than others. We all have the urge to sin- we cannot say "If I wasn't supposed to sin, God would remove the urge to sin". Because we know for a fact that's false.

Celibacy and marriage are different though. Neither are sins that we might be "tempted" to. As Nickolina said, they are both gifts. God won't have you desiring one gift when he wants to you accept another. That's something I hope Kevin realises :)

[45. Jennifer said the following at 9:52 PM on Sep 24:]

45

Tami (39) writes: "I am totally with you on Hintz's article, but I disagree about Lauren Winner. (I also don't think Steve is exactly advocating Hintz's point, but that's another matter.) Where do you see this in Winner's writing?"

Through flowery doublespeak like this:

"What is chastity? One way of putting it is that chastity is doing sex in the body of Christ—doing sex in a way that befits the body of Christ, and that keeps you grounded, and bounded, in the community.."

The phrase "chastity is doing sex in the body of Christ" just smacks of the worst kind of bumpersticker flattery, rife within the modern American church. Talking about chastity as something the whole church (married, included) all practice together is just another hollow nicety to keep singles from feeling left out.

Chastity is chastity: obediently abstaining from premarital sex, period. And it's hard. She talks about chastity in marriage, thus muddling chastity and fidelity. But in reality, there is no parallel between the married who are having sex with their spouses obediently abstaining from adulterous sex and singles who obediently abstain from all sex. Putting us all in the same boat that floats on hoky metaphors doesn't make it any easier for singles, or marrieds for that matter.

Likewise, she invokes the image of chaste single being faithful to God, as one would be faithful to a spouse -- “God desires your person, your body, more than any man or woman ever will”. I think we should steer clear of substituting human relationships we are meant to have with notions of "God as lover", not because it's irreverant, because it's just not supported in the scriptures.

Her "chastity as spiritual discipline" is also dubious. Early Christians did not expect that young people first discipline themselves as chaste singles before considering marriage. They married you off in hurry, lest you be tempted into sin -- no need to test your mettle. Sexual restraint as spiritual maturity/discipline being a prerequisite to marriage is an entirely modern concept.

We can assume that over time chastity would require discipline, but the scriptures don't really treat it as a discipline unto itself that brings you closer to God (although marrieds have the option of abstaining during times of fasting, as per 1 Cor 7:4-5), although its sinful violation would move you further from Him. God may be pleased and blessing us when we avoid sin, and appreciate the sacrifice of a celibate path of Christian service. But nowhere does the Bible speak of refraining from sex (for marrieds or for singles eschewing marriage) in terms of purification, which she comes dangerously close to suggesting.

Elsewhere, Winner drags up the usual "called to singleness/not called to marriage" lingo, with prim warnings not to make marriage into an "idol". So all her hipness, she's really just parroting the platitudes of those "gift of singleness" biddies who shall remain nameless.

[46. Rachael said the following at 10:41 PM on Sep 24:]

46

I second Jeremy (41)'s comment that "but the fact that you are keeping your focus on Scripture and questioning what might seem to be conventional thinking when it does not line up with God's word is an excellent thing."

And honestly, I do not hear people talking about God calling to things all the time and haven't for quite some time. My guess is that if you're hearing people talk like that all the time they are part of church communities that focus on stuff that is different from my church community.

My link to an article about God's will didn't come through in my last comment. Here is the website. And just for kicks, here is another article about God's Will.

Keep up the critical thinking, with humility.

[47. Rachael said the following at 10:43 PM on Sep 24:]

47

One more, Kevin, then I retire (hopefully). About the comfortable comment. Clarification: I should have said: "Theologically comfortable". I think it's okay to pay attention to emotions (uncomfortability) when "Christianese"ish stuff isn't necessarily Biblical.

[48. Sarah P. said the following at 8:04 AM on Sep 25:]

48

OK, I have the 'alcoholism' analogy sorted out. The original argument for a call to celibacy basically states, "If you have a desire to have sex and intimacy, then you are called to have sex and intimacy appropriately (through marriage) at some time in your life."

You can prove this false by negating the consequent. There are people who are apparently not called to have these things appropriately through marriage. Yet they still desire(d) them. So the argument in the first paragraph doesn't hold up.

Alcoholism is a sin; so is sex outside of marriage. However, neither alcohol nor sex is wrong in itself. The alcoholic, however, must not give in to the temptation to drink, just as the single person cannot give in to the temptation to have sex.

So the point is that we all have desires, some good, some bad. But a desire itself is not enough for us to say, "Oh, God wants me to do X." In the case of marriage, I think it is more God-honoring to say, "I want to get married, and holy marriage is something that God blesses." I hope that makes more sense - sorry for the long explanation.

[49. Nickolina said the following at 2:23 PM on Sep 25:]

49

Proverbs 27:7--"A sated man loathes honey, but to a famished man any bitter thing is sweet."

In my Bible, years ago, I wrote this in the margin beside this verse--"If I am not content in the Lord, I'll be tempted to "be content" filling the gap with food, attention, fantasy--and if He has not already filled me those comparatively bitter things are sweet. But if I'm content in Him I will not idolize."

Reading the reactions to "celibacy" in these posts, I see a depth of emotion that brought those years of singleness to mind. Now I am married, and would like to point out that being married does not mean you never again feel alone, rejected, unfulfilled, or sexually frustrated.

I have a very good marriage, but he's human & so am I. We need Jesus: "happily ever after" is for fairy tales unless you're talking about heaven.

[50. Jennifer said the following at 4:18 PM on Sep 25:]

50

Nickolina said : "#36 said, "In scripture, there is no "called to celibacy" (or even "called to marriage" for that matter). No "gift of singleness", no "gift of marriage."

Matthew 19:11, Jesus says that not all men can accept the statement (better not to marry) but only those to whom it has been given.

Being given something=a gift."

The problem with your interpretation is that it assumes that singleness itself is the gift. And it overlooks verse 12, Jesus identifies three types of eunuchs, two of the involuntary variety (those born eunuchs and those made eunuchs by men), as contrasted to the third, who voluntarily "made themselves eunuchs" for the sake of the kingdom.

Note that the first type of eunuch, "so born from their mother's womb", is not described as being made that way by God. This is not to dispute God's sovereignty but to note what the Bible does and does not refer to as a gift or provision of God. Indeed, being in the second case, would certainly have been considered an unfortunate affliction in Bible times, and they both have something in common: neither had any choice in the matter. The whole point of the teaching emerges when he presents the third kind of eunuch, those who MADE THEMSELVES eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom. It is plain to see that Christ is making a distinction between those who have no choice (and would probably never have made such a choice) from those who can choose to sacrifice marriage and all its connubial benefits to fulfill a mission.

Christ then concludes this verse by stating A SECOND TIME the conditions he set in verse 11, reiterating clearly that it is for those capable of receiving it (rather than obeying under compulsion or command from God): Dunamai choreo choreo (He that is able to receive (it), let him receive (it).

So, the gift is being able to receive or hear such a teaching, NOT SINGLENESS ITSELF. Calling involuntary singleness a gift is not helpful, and it doesn't fit with the scriptural narratives on singleness.

I agree that we are to be part of the Body of Christ and to serve Him in obedience and gratitude, regardless of your life situation. But what you do and do not call a gift DOES matter. Look up the word "gift" in the concordance of any bible and you'll see that positive things are called "gifts" and nowhere are negative or adversive things (like illness and infertility) called gifts (even if God can use those things to His glory).

Even if you've been given something by God, doesn't mean it's a gift. We don't call the Ten Commandments as gift, we call it law. We don't call punishment a gift (even if it is in our best interest), it would be cheeky to do so because it obscures God's intentions. Perhaps many of our generation are single, not as a gift, but as a consequence of personal and collective choices. In the past few decades, the insistence that the growing number of singles in the church are single because God "gifted" them that way has actually led to an avoidance of why so many aren't finding their way to marriage. Too many people end up pretending they are content, when they are (understandably) not.

A few of us because concerned about the roots of this problem coming from the proliferation of the "gift of singleness" teachings of the past few decades. This phrase was actually an embellishment of the Living Bible of the 70's (now the NLT), that caught on among singleness writers, becoming somewhat of a rogue doctrine. A few of us became fed up the fact that not only was in not in the original Greek text, but with how it caused so many people to doubt whether or not God was on their side about the goodness of pursuing marriage. So we got together and successfully campaigned to the NLT to have it removed! HALLELUJIAH, IT'S GONE!!

[51. Leah said the following at 7:09 PM on Sep 25:]

51

Jennifer, while I agree with most of your post, I think you go a little off-course when you suggest that chastity is not faithfulness to God like fidelity is faithfulness to a spouse. I heartily agree that we should "steer clear of substituting human relationships we are meant to have with notions of "God as lover"". However, I also think that chastity is faithfulness to God. Any sort of obedience is. When we are obedient to him, we are faithful to him; forsaking all others for his sake. That's what faithfulness is; that's what we practice when we obey God, and it's what we practice when we are loyal to our spouse.

Sarah P said
You can prove this false by negating the consequent. There are people who are apparently not called to have these things appropriately through marriage. Yet they still desire(d) them. So the argument in the first paragraph doesn't hold up.

That makes no sense. Where are these people who do desire sex and intimacy, but who are not called to marriage? How do you know they desire these things? How do you know they are not called to marriage? Perhaps they are but have just ignored it, not wanting the responsibility or commitment.

Your entire argument has no foundation whatsoever. You are stating things as fact when they have no grounding whatsoever.

Show me where the bible talks about, or where in society there are, people who desire sex/intimacy without being called to marriage.

NB: I don't really believe this whole "called to" stuff anyway. In my books, if you desire sex and intimacy, it's quite clear God wants you to marry. Of course you must control those urges until marriage, but it's still on the books for you. God would not give you those desires if he never intended you to fulfil them.

You can NOT equate this with the alcoholism argument. You do not just "have" alcoholic desires- you develop alcoholism yourself by your sinful nature. Do you know anyone who desires to drink themself into oblivion who has never drunk alcohol before? No. Do you know anyone who desires sex and intimacy who has never had it before? Most definitely!

[52. electric_bonzai said the following at 8:09 PM on Sep 25:]

52

What about us who have no "call" to celibacy, but are just asexual?

[53. Eliana said the following at 2:21 AM on Sep 26:]

53

In response to those who say that everyone is under a convenant of Adam and Eve or Noah and must marry, we should remember that Jesus said: "Jesus replied, "Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it." (Matt. 19:11–12). If a marriage convenant from Adam and Noah exists and is still in force, why isn't Jesus condemning these men for not marrying?

There does appear to be some confusion between the terms chaste and celibate. Celibacy, as someone has already mentioned, is a chosen state with vows and only applies to members of the church who have vowed it. Chastity, on the other hand, applies in various ways to all members of the church, married or unmarried.

Celibacy was common in the early church, as some of the best-known Roman martyrs were consecrated virgins, meaning that they had vowed celibacy for life. The best known of these were Saints Thecla (lived in 1st century AD and reputed to be follower of Saint Paul's teaching on celibacy), Agnes (291-304 AD), Perpetua and Felicity (early 200's), Agatha (died 251 AD), Cecilia (died between 176-180 AD), and Lucy (283-304 AD). From the lives of these martyrs and others, it can be seen that the early church did esteem celibacy as a legitimate call from God and worthy of lifelong vows, just as a marriage is a vow that lasts as long as both spouses live.

[54. Mike Theemling said the following at 10:16 AM on Sep 26:]

54

Interesting article but after reading it I'm not sure it's very helpful.

I'll start out with the positives first though. It is good that it acknowledges that singles is a real and pertinent issue and does not belittle or try to shame those who desire marriage as "weak" or "not trusting enough". It also does point out that one ought to make the best use of his/her circumstances and to serve the Kingdom now rather than waiting for marriage to happen first.

However, I do believe that this article puts celibacy (as in lifelong single living) on too high of a pedestal. As if it's something that we should strive for or attain rather than just simply accept if circumstances produce it.

The reason why I'm not a big fan of espousing (no pun intended) the "religious order way of living" (vows or no vows) is that quite frankly in many cases it doesn't work. Look at the Roman Catholic Church priesthood (and my apologies in advance, I'm not trying to demonize them but I believe it is a fair example). Right now you have a severe shortage of priests, and of those you do have, you undoubtedly have a number who struggle immensely with their sexuality to the point of releasing it in unhealthy ways. With women I believe the problem is under better control, but that does not mean it should be something practiced.

The article talks about Paul being single and his wishing that "everyone were like he was". However, most scholars agree that Paul probably was at one time married as that was a mandate (or at least a very strong push) of Benjamite priesthood. And Paul himself called himself a "Hebrew of Hebrews". Most likely his wife either died or left him because of his conversion. The point should not be that "Jesus/Paul was single so we ought to be too" but rather despite our circumstance, we should still serve God. Desiring/pursuing a spouse does not negate that.

It is true that the Bible does say that the celibate life is higher, special calling because of one's sole devotion to pleasing God rather than God and family. However, Jesus said that those "who can accept this should accept it". I would argue that most can't accept it and it's nothing to be ashamed over.

And that's the "problem" with the Church today in America regarding this issue. Rather than try to remedy the problem by encouraging marriage and spiritual development in preparation towards it we discourage it ("Wait for God to provide someone", "Focus on Him", and other true yet feckless soundbites). The message here seems to imply, "Since so many people will end up single anyway" let's encourage more of them to consider lifelong celibacy." This I believe is a mistake that will only backfire. Fact of the matter is most people DO want to be a loving, meaningful marriage relationship (maybe the age at which that realization comes is later, but it still comes to just about everyone).

Just my thoughts.

[55. Jennifer said the following at 10:22 AM on Sep 26:]

55

Nickolina said : "#36 said, "In scripture, there is no "called to celibacy" (or even "called to marriage" for that matter). No "gift of singleness", no "gift of marriage."
Matthew 19:11, Jesus says that not all men can accept the statement (better not to marry) but only those to whom it has been given.
Being given something=a gift."

The problem with your interpretation is that it assumes that singleness itself is the gift Jesus was referring to. And it overlooks verse 12, where Jesus identifies three types of eunuchs, two of the involuntary variety (those born eunuchs and those made eunuchs by men), as contrasted to the third, who voluntarily "made themselves eunuchs" for the sake of the kingdom.

Note that the first type of eunuch, "so born from their mother's womb", is not described as being made that way by God. This is not to dispute God's sovereignty but to note what the Bible does and does not refer to as a gift or provision of God. Indeed, being in the second case, would certainly have been considered an unfortunate affliction in Bible times, and they both have something in common: neither had any choice in the matter. The whole point of the teaching emerges when he presents the third kind of eunuch, those who MADE THEMSELVES eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom. It is plain to see that Christ is making a distinction between those who have no choice (and would probably never have made such a choice) from those who can choose to sacrifice marriage and all its connubial benefits to fulfill a mission.

Christ then concludes this verse by stating A SECOND TIME the conditions he set in verse 11, reiterating clearly that it is for those capable of receiving it (rather than obeying under compulsion or command from God): Dunamai choreo choreo (He that is able to receive (it), let him receive (it).

So, the gift is being able to receive or hear such a teaching, NOT SINGLENESS ITSELF. Calling involuntary singleness a gift is not helpful, and it doesn't fit with the scriptural narratives on singleness.
I agree that we are to be part of the Body of Christ and to serve Him in obedience and gratitude, regardless of your life situation. But what you do and do not call a gift DOES matter. Look up the word "gift" in the concordance of any bible and you'll see that positive things are called "gifts" and nowhere are negative or adversive things (like illness and infertility) called gifts (even if God can use those things to His glory).

Even if you've been given something by God, doesn't mean it's a gift. We don't call the Ten Commandments as gift, we call it law. We don't call punishment a gift (even if it is in our best interest), it would be cheeky to do so because it obscures God's intentions. Perhaps many of our generation are single, not as a gift, but as a consequence of personal and collective choices. In the past few decades, the insistence that the growing number of singles in the church are single because God "gifted" them that way has actually led to an avoidance of why so many aren't finding their way to marriage. Too many people end up pretending they are content, when they are (understandably) not.

A few of us because concerned about the roots of this problem coming from the proliferation of the "gift of singleness" teachings of the past few decades. This phrase was actually an embellishment of the Living Bible of the 70's (now the NLT), that caught on among singleness writers, becoming somewhat of a rogue doctrine. A few of us became fed up the fact that not only was in not in the original Greek text, but with how it caused so many people to doubt whether or not God was on their side about the goodness of pursuing marriage. So we got together and successfully campaigned to the NLT to have it removed! HALLELUJIAH, IT'S GONE!!

[56. Jennifer said the following at 11:46 AM on Sep 26:]

56

Hi Leah,

I agree that any kind of obedience is a kind of faithfulness to God, but I think that's a different kind of faithfulness (just as there are different kinds of love, ie. agape, eros, etc.)

[57. Nickolina said the following at 12:45 PM on Sep 26:]

57

in reply to #50--

I am glad you brought your study of the original language into your post, God's word has final authority.

The ability to "receive" a teaching may well be what Jesus was referring to in that instance, but does that negate a view of giftedness including all you have been given? What have you NOT been given, in truth?

The label "gift" applies to far more than temporary pleasure, and all things work together for ultimate good (Romans 8). It does not seem a stretch to put all our circumstances and limitations and, dare I say, even sins into His hands & trust Him to use all for His glory & our good since that is His promise.

However, changing the label of "gift" doesn't change our responsibility. I've heard various teaching on "gifts" and have come to the conclusion that it's an area that causes sidetracking because the edges are fuzzy. I should've thought of that before I used the term!

[58. Sarah P. said the following at 1:24 PM on Sep 26:]

58

Leah (#51): I don't really want to argue for the sake or arguing, but I appreciate being challenged on things that may be incorrect. Let me clarify my thoughts a little and see if that helps.

I was making fundamental theological assumptions, as follows:
(1) If God calls you to do something, you will do it, because He is sovereign. (And the way you know this "call" is because of where you are right now. That's where you're called to be.)
(2) Some people who desire marriage nonetheless do not get married.
(conclusion) Therefore, some people who desire marriage are not called by God to marriage.

I am coming to peace with the realization that I may desire lots of things in this life, but God has not promised I will get them here. If and when I get married, it will be an amazing gift, not something that I am guaranteed because of my heart's loneliness.

OK, so it looks like "alcoholism" isn't a good analogy. I think the points underlying the attempted analogy are still sound, however. :)

[59. Jennifer said the following at 4:09 PM on Sep 26:]

59

Nickolina (49) wrote: "Reading the reactions to "celibacy" in these posts, I see a depth of emotion that brought those years of singleness to mind. Now I am married, and would like to point out that being married does not mean you never again feel alone, rejected, unfulfilled, or sexually frustrated...I have a very good marriage, but he's human & so am I. We need Jesus: "happily ever after" is for fairy tales unless you're talking about heaven."

I'm not sure that you understand. In the decades since your wedding, the marriage rates (especially among devout Christian women) have been declining. What you are hearing is a collective response to something that is pretty much a global problem among evangelical women, many of whom will never marry or have children due to the shortage of men in the church that has worsened over the past few decades. These singles are not idolators, lacking in faith -- justifiably worried about something that is real. God has designed women to worry about time slipping away -- it's called the biological clock! Yes, we are to have faith, but faith does not mean that by having genuine human emotions that they are somehow idolizing or idealizing marriage.

Candice Watters, one of the writers here at Boundless wrote about why those helping marriage-minded singles shouldn't be so quick to bring out the contentment sermons and reminders not to make marriage an idol, aptly pointing out that no one seems to tell singles not to make their careers into an a idol! This article is available in the Boundless archives (Marriage, An Idol?)

[60. Adam said the following at 12:47 PM on Sep 27:]

60

Jennifer,

This phrase was actually an embellishment of the Living Bible of the 70's (now the NLT), that caught on among singleness writers, becoming somewhat of a rogue doctrine. A few of us became fed up the fact that not only was in not in the original Greek text, but with how it caused so many people to doubt whether or not God was on their side about the goodness of pursuing marriage. So we got together and successfully campaigned to the NLT to have it removed! HALLELUJIAH, IT'S GONE!!

Why do you continue to propigate this story? You know what the translators themselves said, and yet you continue to believe this? For those who are interested, I know one of the translators of the NLT, and I asked him about this. His response was interesting. You can read all of the relevant documentation here:

http://puritancalvinist.blogspot.com/2008/04/reports-of-death-of-gift-of-singleness.html

Notice, all Jennifer could do in response to this in the comments section is just say "whatever." The reality is that the NLT translators changed nothing in the text because they agreed with Jennifer and those who wrote them. They did reconsider the passage, and found that, though the text is referring to singleness as a gift, it is way to narrow to translate it as "gift of singleness" because it breaks up the connection between this discussion and Paul's later discussion of spiritual gifts. In fact, if you look at the link I gave, they specifically disagree with Jennifer's interpretation of this passage. The only thing with which they agreed is that this text cannot be used to force someone to remain single, something that no one ever taught in the first place!

Jennifer also says it is not "in the Greek." Again, what is meant by that. If you mean it is not a literal translation of the Greek, then she would be correct. However, neither is "speak kindly to Jerusalem" a literal translation of Isaiah 40:2. It literally reads "speak to the heart of Jerusalem." This is one of the issues in translation. All translations are, in some sense of the word, an interpretation. The question is how literal should you be in your translation, since, as is the case with Isaiah 40:2, if you are too literal, some of the meaning might be lost.

As I understand it, originally, the NLT translators wanted to emphasize that singleness is being called a gift in this passage. However, while making revisions for the current edition of the NLT, they realized that, by translating it in this fashion, it broke up the theme of spiritual gifts which runs throughout the end of 1 Corinthians. That is the delemma that confronted the translators of the NLT when they were reconsidering this passage. Hence, nothing whatsoever was changed because of anything Jennifer and those who wrote the NLT translators said, and to say that this change was made as a result of their "campaigning" is simply wrong.

In fact, Nickolina, you should know that Jennifer does not know Greek. Even this very post proves that, as she said that the Greek reads:

Dunamai choreo choreo

Actually, the Greek reads:

ho dunamenos chorein choreito

Another good example is this:

Look up the word "gift" in the concordance of any bible and you'll see that positive things are called "gifts" and nowhere are negative or adversive things (like illness and infertility) called gifts (even if God can use those things to His glory).

You need to understand that, when you do this, you ignore all of the language that can be used to convey the concept of a "gift" that is not actually the word "gift" itself. A good example of this is the term "trinity." All orthodox Christians believe God is a trinity, and yet, the specific term is not in the Bible. Consider if someone wanted to argue that we need to be careful about what we call a trinity, since the Bible never calls God a trinity. Now, wouldn't we all agree that such would be fallacious?

As far as these things being a gift, here is the language of gift applied in the context of evil things that happen in our lives, as well as good things:

Lamentations 3:37-38 Who is there who speaks and it comes to pass, Unless the Lord has commanded it? 38 Is it not from the mouth of the Most High That both good and ill go forth?

And, Nickolina brought up the classic passage in this regard:

Romans 8:28 And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose.

I just simply wanted to put this out there for people so that they know both sides of this, and decide for themselves. Often, when we hear Greek being thrown out there, and we hear that someone convinced a translator of something, our critical reasoning shuts down, and it should not. We need to be careful and discerning even when someone is throwing out Greek, and talking about translators. I hope that the reader will do just that.

God Bless,
Adam

[61. Michele said the following at 9:04 AM on Sep 28:]

61

For Kevin: I was listening to a pastor this week who often counsels college students asking about this very issue. (Not knowing God's will for their lives)

He will ask them "Well, what DO you know?"

In other words, maybe you don't know your vocation, or whether or not you'll marry, but you do know something about God's will - He has given us all commands in the Bible. What's the last thing you felt convicted on? Often, these students will realize there is some way they can bring their lives more in harmony with the Word of God.

Go back to the last thing God clearly told you, - a Bible text you read, a conviction, something that your conscience told you, unbiased counsel from a godly friend.

Even if it seems trivial, or easy, or unimportant.

I'm not making assumptions about your Spiritual walk; I think everyone, including myself needs to do this. We humans tend to neglect what God has already given us.

If God does not answer a question, it is often because He is waiting for you to pay attention to something He has already told you, OR it is not His will to answer your question just yet, because the answer will not help you right now. Often, it is a combination of both.

Not knowing you, and not being God, I can't tell you if you are doing something wrong or if God is simply saying "Wait."

But God has not predestined you for Hell, nor does He just enjoy watching you being confused.

John 16:12-13: "I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth..."

James 1:5 says, If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives liberally to all without finding fault.

God wants to answer you, but you may not be able to handle the answer to the questions you're asking right away.

Imagine a scenario for a second. (This is purely my imagination, so the details aren't important)

What if God's will is something like "Spend ten years in marketing, 2 years as as shoe salesmen, and then die as a martyr after being a missionary for three months?"

If something like that WAS God's will, do you really need to know that today?

God could be asking you to do the best you can in the job you have now, NOT tell you about the marketing job until you get offered it, NOT tell you that you are going to work there for TEN years, (not 20 or five years) until you find yourself as a shoe salemen, and then NOT tell you you're going to be a missionary until two years later, and then, when He calls you as a missionary, not mention the part about being a martyr.

You see where I'm going with this? The only part of your calling or destiny you would know in this scenario, is what you doing right at the moment. Be the best shoe salemen or marketer or missionary, or whatever you are right now. Along the way, there will be many little opportunities to share the love of God, opportunities that may not seem big or important, but which may have eternal consequences for someone involved.

The only time you would HAVE to know your calling, is when you are faced with a decision to be made right now.

Even then, God may lead through circumstances, and not a direct revelation.

The opportunities God has put in front of you now ARE His calling on your life. When He wants you to make some life-altering decision, He'll let you know.

Look at James 4:13-17. Sometimes God does not want us to plan too far ahead; He may not even plan for us to be alive tomorrow. That's okay. What God wants us to do is those good things we know we ought to do. He will unfold the big plans as we need to know them.

[62. Leah said the following at 5:36 PM on Sep 28:]

62

Jennifer- I think I see what you're saying, but I think there are bigger differences between the different loves than faithfulnesses. Faithfulness, whether to God or spouse, is staying loyal to that person and keeping yourself for them. I think that is what people would mean when saying that being faithful to God is like being faithful to a spouse. You're being loyal to them and keeping yourself for them.

Mike Theemling - I understand where you're coming from in regards to Catholic priests. However, I don't think you can quite equate that with basic celibacy. I think that a priest, first and foremost, is choosing that profession because he wants to be a priest. The celibacy is a requirement that follows. I would completely agree that this requirement should be unnecessary. However if someone were to choose celibacy for its own merits and because they have no desire for sexual intimacy, I think that's another matter.

In the first instance, you are far more likely to have people being "caught" in the celibate lifestyle when celibacy itself was never what they really wanted. In the second instance, you are far less likely, because these people have specifically chosen celibacy.

I could be wrong of course, but that's my impression.

[63. Jennifer said the following at 5:38 PM on Sep 29:]

63

"The reality is that the NLT translators changed nothing in the text because they agreed with Jennifer and those who wrote them."

The reality is that the NLT changed their translation of 1 Cor 7:7, which used to read..

..."But I wish everyone were single, just as I am. But God gives to some the GIFT OF MARRIAGE, and to others the GIFT OF SINGLENESS."

...to now read: "But I wish everyone were single, just as I am. Yet each person has a special gift from God, of one kind or another."

Upon making this change, the NLT editors notified us and sent each one of us complimentary copies of the latest NLT edition -- which speaks volumes about their responsiveness to ordinary, lay readers who bring up concerns about their modern interpretations of the text!

About Adam's post...we corresponded with NLT editors about his claims and were assured that he took their words out of context. In a nutshell, they don't see all singleness as a gift anymore than we do, particularly when it's a "thorn in the flesh" (their words) for so many these days. Yet they do respect that some single individuals may have a "special gift of God", like Paul, as stated in their new translation. As such, they noted the old version could be misinterpreted and generalized to all singleness, which was never their intention. Therefore they were quite happy to change it -- fine with us, we didn't need a big theological explanation, we were just glad they did it.

[64. Leah said the following at 11:11 PM on Sep 29:]

64

Jennifer, can I point out how very wrong you are to say God has designed women to worry about time slipping away.

God clearly says that we should not worry. To worry indicates a lack of trust in God, which is sin. "Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life?"

Yes, we should be aware of our time limit in regards to getting married (as you said, our biological clock). Being aware is not the same as worrying.

Sarah P- I took issue with the alcoholism analogy because I thought that rather than explain the points, it clouded the issue and was misleading. I wasn't trying to argue for arguments' sake :)

I am still puzzled by your assumption that Some people who desire marriage nonetheless do not get married.
As I said in my last post, can you provide biblical or social examples of this? I won't go so far as to say outright that you are wrong, but I have not seen any evidence to support that idea. I know that God does not always give us our heart's desires, but in pretty much all those cases you can point to a bible passage that still explains the time of waiting or suffering that you're experiencing. There is no such evidence in the bible that God would permanently withhold marriage from someone who desired it (that I have read).

[65. Nickolina said the following at 6:58 AM on Sep 30:]

65

In response to #59 and the idea of marriage being an "idol", every time I am disappointed in a situation it is because I had idealized my own scenario for it. And quite often, when my emotions are tied to the outcome of my scenario, I realize that I'm guilty of idolatry; expecting that earthly thing to satisfy a permanent need that only God fills.

Having better hindsight than foresight, I see the perspective later. It is not that emotions are bad: Jesus was able to express His feelings about the coming crucifixion freely without sin. The trick is "not my will but Thine". I visualize the process like that of holding my hand out the window while driving...as long as my hand is open, it feels full. When I try to grasp the wind, it feels empty. That grasping is a picture of what I do when I idolize.

Married people can idolize singleness, imagine that! We all are a bunch of idolaters, in truth.

And I must point out that this generation of single women is not the first to have a dearth of potential mates and that each heart's pain makes it feel alone regardless of statistics.

[66. Jennifer said the following at 1:13 PM on Sep 30:]

66

Leah writes "Jennifer, can I point out how very wrong you are to say God has designed women to worry about time slipping away...God clearly says that we should not worry. To worry indicates a lack of trust in God, which is sin. "Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life?"

Yes, I'm familiar with that passage, Leah. But it certainly is not a claim that all worry is sin, or that anyone is capable of living without worry, fear, anger, grief, or any other emotions that are part of the affective spectrum and have important functions in keeping us alive. When you declare a sin something that is so universal (especially with such limited biblical support), you do more harm than good. It is inevitable that certain emotions be tied to certain outcomes -- can you imagine not feeling grief for the death of a beloved husband or child? Singles also feel grief, as years go by and doors for having children of their own become shut forever. No amount of prayer or admonishments amieliate this kind of grief, which like a cut, must always heal at the pace of its own divine design.

About "idolatry", another harmful concept when overapplied and overused...

...In her "Marriage, An Idol?" article, Candice Watters wrote the following:

"But today there's an added reason women hide their desire for marriage. They've been told and retold that nurturing such a desire will not only scare men off, but worst of all, it may lead them to idolatry. I see and hear this warning a lot among Christians. It seems anytime someone writes or preaches about marriage to singles, they start with the caveat that wanting marriage is good 'as long as you don't make an idol out of it.' Can the desire for marriage really become an idol? It's technically possible. But that notion has been blown out of proportion. And repeatedly suggesting the possibility of idolatry has done more harm than good. It's caused a lot of women to be tepid in their approach to marriage and made them afraid that any amount of thinking or acting on their desire might be a sin. Both have the unfortunate consequence of making marriage even less likely to happen."

She goes on to say that in the scriptures, idolatry is a serious charge, something that you don't take lightly. But it's become almost a knee jerk response to singles who express any desire for marriage -- not that anyone ever uses this lable to describe those who are driven in terms of career!

Even on Boundless today, there's an article "Mind the Single-minded Church", that speaks to this issue:

"One single man, quoted in Julia Duin's Quitting Church, talked about his experience of telling his small group that he wanted to get married,

I' was rebuked by the elders because, according to them, the Bible says it is better to be single to serve God better. They, obviously, were married, and I didn't understand, if they felt so strongly about being single, why they themselves weren't single. When I would ask for prayer, I would get a lecture about being content, and was told I needed to stop focusing on self and serve God better.'

Duin noted how, during research for her book, she "kept running into stories about ministers who were indifferent about singles issues until their own children began looking for mates." The pastor she spotlighted did little to nothing to match the singles in his church body, even as he "went about the church, telling everyone how wonderfully God had answered their [family's] prayers [for a husband for his daughter].... The incident caused quite a stir among the single women in that church," she said.

While references to being content in singleness might make singles feel more comfortable in the short term, in the long term, they're a disservice to singles who desire to marry well."

The rest of the article illustrates why it's important to respond meaningfully to this generation of grieving Christian singles who missed out on marriage. "There's more to life than marriage, marriage is hard" is fine for the very young, but those who are looking around themselves at the reality of declining marriage rates (which get worse with each year), WE MUST DROP THE USUAL CLICHES AND PLATITUDES, if our witness is to be genuine.

[67. Sarah P. said the following at 2:09 PM on Sep 30:]

67

Leah (#64): There is no such evidence in the bible that God would permanently withhold marriage from someone who desired it (that I have read).

Hmm. Emily Dickinson? heh. Or after big wars in which many millions of men died. One would have to assume that millions of women in turn did not find husbands. A double tragedy. How about folks who die in their teens or twenties?

People have had to have legs amputated who definitely didn't want that. People have been born blind who would have liked to see. People have lost new spouses in sudden tragedy only a few weeks after marriage. I no longer assume anything about life. I very much want to be married at some point, but I don't think this desire guarantees marriage. It certainly doesn't guarantee a good marriage.

So I am praying for my future husband and myself to grow strongly toward God until the day that we meet. God has no obligation to answer that prayer with "yes." He has no obligation to give me breath or a heartbeat tomorrow, for that matter.

Is this depressing? Well, it's deep and intense and hard to deal with. But I'd rather deal with truth, even if it's difficult. And then there's faith, which is "knowing that God is, and that He delights to reward those who diligently seek Him." I appreciate the rewards even more, I think, when I realize that they are not something I am due. :)

[68. Nickolina said the following at 3:50 PM on Sep 30:]

68

"it's important to respond meaningfully to this generation of grieving Christian singles who missed out on marriage. "There's more to life than marriage, marriage is hard" is fine for the very young, but those who are looking around themselves at the reality of declining marriage rates (which get worse with each year), WE MUST DROP THE USUAL CLICHES AND PLATITUDES, if our witness is to be genuine."

If the usual cliches and platitudes are an accurate picture of your experience, would that count as genuine witness? The reason many of them become platitudes and cliches is the universality of application. Yes, there are exceptions, but not that many.

"There's more to life than marriage, marriage is hard" is not just "fine for the very young", it is one facet of the trials and tribulations Jesus spoke of and the speaker may have been trying to put things in that perspective. Is "rejoice, I have overcome the world" trite?

Learning to be "content in whatever state I am in" is a universal lesson that applies to all areas of life. Contentment does not mean you have no unfulfilled desires or responsibility to act on desire wisely, it means you are trusting God today. I am content with my house, but I still have to clean it and maintain it: one is an attitude, the other a responsibility.

If I were talking directly to a "grieving single" my words would be dependent upon the interchange. Grieving people need presence rather than sermons. There's a time factor, a relationship factor, and a prayer factor among many other details. My experience, the "comfort with which I have been comforted", is how I learn to comfort others. If we weren't all human, we wouldn't be able to comfort each other. Humans are barely adequate when it comes to communicating, so we tend to say what has been said to us if it seems to fit.

Posts are limited to the words typed and the attitude they are read in. My posts are edited before I post 'em and the presence of a preview button indicates most of us read our words before posting. I do not think the writers intend their words to be considered trite or meaningless. The effort spent indicates a concern that their words be taken seriously.

[69. Jennifer said the following at 7:28 PM on Sep 30:]

69

"If the usual cliches and platitudes are an accurate picture of your experience, would that count as genuine witness?"

It can be, if the person you're talking to has had a much different experience, which I think is the case when those married a couple of decades ago try to encourage singles today. You can be incredibly well-intended but miss the mark, if you are not well informed -- or are at least willing to be filled in on some of the things that have changed, as detailed by Candice Watters, Debbie Maken, Julia Duin and others who have been writing lately about Christian singleness -- ignore them at your peril, if your desire is to reach out to singles.

What they are saying is that the old contentment sermons just aren't cutting it anymore, if anything, they only serve to alienate singles rather than inspire them. They have not become platitudes and cliches because of their "universality of application" but because of their effectiveness in shutting people up.

"Is rejoice, I have overcome the world" trite?

It can be, if spoken too soon, too often, or for the wrong reasons. Some people think that Bible verses are magic, that quoting them can only do good, not harm. This is not the case and is one thing that alienates those on the edge of church, because of losses or disillusionment. I think I hear you saying that you'd ordinarily use more discretion than that, which is good. So I hope you read those articles I've mentioned, because you might want to add some updated understanding your message to singles.

[70. Sarah P. said the following at 8:04 AM on Oct 1:]

70

You have a lot of wisdom, Nickolina, and you write well. Have you ever considered publishing a book?

[71. Nickolina said the following at 12:43 PM on Oct 4:]

71

I think the bottom of this page has strayed from the original topic....

in reply to #69, you are right in observing that it is easy to stray into the state of not hearing each other. Have you noticed how a statement from your mom that once caused eye-rolling now makes sense? There's a lot of factors involved in profitable discussions and time is one of them.

I don't consider myself having a "ministry to singles"; I have a ministry to those God has put in my sphere and it includes a number of singles who talk to me quite often. We are a homeschool family, they tend to be less age-segregated; now that all are adult I have more time to do things like read Boundless and expand my horizons (cliche!) but life is still pretty full. I will try to read the articles, thanks for suggesting them.

In reply to #70--I have threatened for years to write a book titled, "How to be the Happy Wife of a Human Husband" and finally caved to pressure and started a blog called Human Husband/Happy Wife. Definitely off topic! And if I got paid, it'd be easier to justify the time spent.

[72. Idumi said the following at 12:00 AM on Oct 8:]

72

Sorry for dropping in your comment.

[1. Carrie (the original) said the following at 9:51 AM on Sep 22:]

1

I've said it once, but I'll say it again: read Lauren Winner's "Real Sex: The Naked Truth About Chastity".

I'm glad that I have a pastor who understands my dilemma. Just because I want to have sex doesn't excuse me from behaving chastely. You can still set yourself apart doesn't mean that you ignore some aspect of your humanity.
Sex within the bounds of marriage: good.
Unchaste behavior: bad.

[2. obewan said the following at 10:17 AM on Sep 22:]

2

The OP said:
>>"...while all Christian singles are called to be distinctly set apart from the world, only a few are called to sacrifice marriage permanently as a demonstration of that holy distinction."<<
-------------------------------------
While I understand the distinction between the two, I continue to struggle with the word "permanent".

How long must singles who want to be married wait before they are to be placed into the "permanent celibate" slot? And, why should the "permanent celibate" label enable someone who is currently single to better serve? Shouldn't singles already be serving? And finally, how permanent is "permanent"? Are singles that would renege and marry in old age then cheaters? I mean, I have heard a lot of stories about priests who eventually fell in love and married - even in old age. Some of them married widows etc...

[3. Adam said the following at 10:37 AM on Sep 22:]

3

I think this idea of being "Celibate" is a small step in the right direction.
I appreciate that Boundless has published a blog that tries to put a slightly more positive spin on being single.

It seems as if being single is largely considered to be a transitive state in between adolescence and adulthood that is to be ended as soon as possible. We are encouraged to
"Get Married". A guy who is seen to be embracing the joys of singlehood is viewed as living in "Guyland".

It would be interesting to see what would happen if singleness was embraced and celebrated in the way that marriage is (not the ceremony, but rather the state of being). Perhaps if it were, some salve towards the pain and frustration of singlehood would be applied.

[4. Carrie (the original) said the following at 10:41 AM on Sep 22:]

4

"How long must singles who want to be married wait before they are to be placed into the "permanent celibate" slot?"

If they enter heaven's gates and never married, they earned the "permanent celibate" slot.
I think we should only define time when and how God does. We can say something is permanent, but then we have to eat our words when it changes 3 days, 3 months, or 3 years down the line.

[5. Matt from DC said the following at 10:58 AM on Sep 22:]

5

"How long must singles who want to be married wait before they are to be placed into the "permanent celibate" slot?"

Until they die.

"And, why should the "permanent celibate" label enable someone who is currently single to better serve?"

Here is how the apostle Paul answers this question:

1 Cor 7:32-35

32I would like you to be free from concern. An unmarried man is concerned about the Lord's affairs—how he can please the Lord. 33But a married man is concerned about the affairs of this world—how he can please his wife— 34and his interests are divided. An unmarried woman or virgin is concerned about the Lord's affairs: Her aim is to be devoted to the Lord in both body and spirit. But a married woman is concerned about the affairs of this world—how she can please her husband. 35I am saying this for your own good, not to restrict you, but that you may live in a right way in undivided devotion to the Lord.

"Shouldn't singles already be serving?"
Of course.

"And finally, how permanent is "permanent"?"
Very.

"Are singles that would renege and marry in old age then cheaters?"
No, but they aren't permanently celibate, either.

[6. mary kate said the following at 11:38 AM on Sep 22:]

6

i've been thinking a lot more about this stuff lately, as i picked up and re-read "passion and purity" by elisabeth elliot. i encourage all singles to read it, multiple times if you can :)

i've been single for 10 years (minus about 3 months of a relationship). i know that i will be married someday. but, today, i am single.

p&p reminded me that what is most important is living god's way, and, like the article says, chastity/celibacy means a lot more than just that i'm not sleeping with anyone. it means living my life according to god's standards of purity. is it difficult? yes, especially after some of the choices i've made in the past. but is it worth it? oh yeah. totally. i'm not in a relationship, but i already see the benefits of bending my life/myself to meet god's standards.

i'm not so sure about the vows thing. to me it's more about daily bread. i don't know how much longer i'll be single. but i know that i am right where i need to be today. tomorrow can worry about itself.

[7. obewan said the following at 12:25 PM on Sep 22:]

7

Matt:

I appreciate your scripture reference, but my take on it is that 1 Cor 7:32-35 should be applied by all singles, not just those who are "permenantly celibate." I mean it keeps me going when I get down in the mouth about not having met Miss. Right yet.

[8. Holly (the married, parent one) said the following at 12:27 PM on Sep 22:]

8

"Chastity" is a calling for both the Christian single who will eventually marry and the one who vows to forgo the blessings of Christian marriage for undivided devotion to God in celibacy.

I would submit to you that chastity is not an un-married person's calling, rather a believer's calling. Of course chastity looks different for a married believer than a single believer, but it is every bit as important. As a married woman, chastity for me is faithfulness to my marital vows and modesty outside of them. Chastity means I don't dress provocatively outside of my bedroom and I don't' seek attention from other men.

Chastity is not temporary (unlike its cousin celibacy), it will just look different in different seasons of life.

[9. Anonymous said the following at 1:31 PM on Sep 22:]

9

Debbie Maken, would you care to weigh in if you've read the post? :-) I'm curious about your perspective.

[10. Aurora said the following at 1:33 PM on Sep 22:]

10

The celibacy question always raises fear in the hearts of singles. It's the fear we have that God will ask us to do the one thing we don't want to do -- remain single, without opportunity to enjoy all the benefits of marriage, include a healthy, God-centered sex life. A pastor I heard once said that if you have to work at maintaining your purity, chances are good you don't have the gift of celibacy or the gift of singleness and that you should expect to get married at some point in your life. Or God would remove the urge/need to couple and would give a contentment/satisfaction in life as a single person. If you aren't gifted with singleness, you then had/have the responsibility of living a life worthy of Christ -- living a life of chastity until such time as you were given in marriage. I think some singles are so fearful that marriage won't come that any hint that we might have to "stay this way forever" is just frightening. Chalk one up for the enemy when we choose to listen to his fear-mongering and not trust the God who loves us and cares deeply about our hopes and dreams.

[11. Kevin said the following at 1:47 PM on Sep 22:]

11

"...feel called to celibacy...,...life to which singles are called...,...as called-out ones...,...do not feel called to celibacy...,...believe they are called to marriage...,...'Chastity' is a calling...,...only a few are called to sacrifice marriage..."

Ok, so what do we do if we don't know what we're being 'called' to? What if we've never heard God or felt God call us to anything? What if we've been praying constantly and reading the entire bible through and crying out to God for well over a year for truth and clarity and to know what God wants us to do and haven't felt God call us at all? What then?

[12. Tami said the following at 2:32 PM on Sep 22:]

12

Amen, Aurora (10).

I am neither a freak, nor forsaken by God, because I am not yet married.

And, God hears my prayers... He alone knows me well enough to give me the right gift, at the right time.

What I need to do is, pray and affirm this: I will not be frightened by any fear. And I hear married women need to do this, too [1 Peter 3:5-6] :)

[13. Adam said the following at 2:42 PM on Sep 22:]

13

Steve,

Are you saying that "undistracted devotion" to the Lord" refers to some kind of service to God in terms of the church or gospel service? Can you give me any lexical sources for your interpretation of this term in this fashion?

In fact, this is a rejection of the protestant teaching on vocation. Here is an interesting article from a Lutheran Seminary discussing Luther's view of vocation to document that very fact:

http://www.luthersem.edu/word&world/Archives/3-4_Luther/3-4_Kolden.pdf

Luther believed that wherever we are at in life, we are to serve God. Battling the sinful nature, and putting to death the desires of the flesh. Also, growing in holiness and in wisdom in all areas of life, including our job, family, and church relationships is part of the protestant concept of vocation. This is what I believe "undestracted devotion" is referring to in this passage.

What Paul is saying here is that a married person has a more difficult time with this because of the fact that they have divided interests. Often times, one can have one's concerns for their wife get in the way of one's devotion to the Lord. Not that it must be that way, but we in our flesh tend to make it that way. Expecially in the context of the "present distress [v.26]," when you can focus on the safety of your family so much, that you forget for whom you are ultimately taking care of your family. What Paul is saying is that, if you are single, you do not have these distractions, and can pursue complete devotion to God without them.

When Paul said "I wish you were as I am," he meant much more than just his marital status. He meant a life entirely distinct and set apart from the culture of his day for God's service.

Actually, that didn't mean "a life entirely distinct and set apart from the culture of his day for God's service." The only thing being discussed in the passage is marital status. Where, specifically, is all of the rest of that in this in 1 Corinthians 7:1-6?

While I agree that there may be many singles out there who are, indeed, single and immature, ungodly, etc., the problem is with their *immaturity,* not their marital status. Once they turn their lives around, and live their life after Christ, whether they are in gospel/church ministry or not, they will have this "undistracted devotion" Paul is talking about here.

God Bless,
Adam

[14. Sarah P. said the following at 3:08 PM on Sep 22:]

14

Kevin (#11) says: Ok, so what do we do if we don't know what we're being 'called' to? . . .

I hear you. I struggled and struggled with this at one particularly painful time of life. God doesn't usually thunder to us down from Heaven and say, "Here is my point by point plan for your life." But He does talk to us. His words are written down in the Bible, and the Holy Spirit illuminates them to us. That is how we hear Him -- not in the storm of feelings, but in the still, quiet, difficult, written truth. Some truths:

- God will never leave us nor forsake us.
- God does not "punish" us because we "mess up" (Heb. 12-13). In fact, He all things will work together for our good (i.e., Christ-likeness). And when we do something stupid that faces earthly repercussions now, we can rejoice in that suffering, because it produces patience, experience, and hope.
- We are completely, utterly, free from the law.
- In short, we can do and try anything, and only fear stands in the way! And perfect love casts out fear. We can do all things through Christ which strengthens us.

Aurora (#10) says: The celibacy question always raises fear in the hearts of singles. It's the fear we have that God will ask us to do the one thing we don't want to do -- remain single, without opportunity to enjoy all the benefits of marriage, include a healthy, God-centered sex life.

God asks us to live one day at a time and not to be anxious for what will happen tomorrow. What is my calling? It is to do the best with what I can, right now, today, and leave the rest to His grace.

I think the problem I have with that description of the "call to celibacy," Aurora, is that you can apply the same argument to any number of things, including alcoholism. "If I wasn't supposed to be an alcoholic, God would remove the urge to drink." Hmm. I know, like Carrie, I feel the sex urge now. Yet I am single, and who knows for how long, or if I will walk to the end of my life and look back and find myself still single?

Right now, this is my calling: To turn my loneliness into solitude. And yes, to trust God enough to be purposeful with this time and believe that I am not big enough to destroy His purpose for my life.

[15. mary kate said the following at 3:19 PM on Sep 22:]

15

kevin #11:
Stop seeking answers and start seeking HIM. just spend time with him. do you believe He'll tell you? ok, then relax. He'll tell you. read the bible through just to learn about him and be with him, not to get answers. which do you want more: answers and gifts, or an amazing relationship with the giver?

[16. Christina (in green) said the following at 3:49 PM on Sep 22:]

16

Kevin (#11)
Ok, so what do we do if we don't know what we're being 'called' to?

PRAY

What if we've never heard God or felt God call us to anything?

PRAY SOME MORE

Pray in the Spirit at all times and on every occasion. Stay alert and be persistent in your prayers for all believers everywhere.
-Ephesians 6:18

And you are one of the believers everywhere ;)

[17. Laura said the following at 6:36 PM on Sep 22:]

17

Kevin, and others who've responded to him: figuring out the will of God is not about waiting for someone to come along and say, "Thus sayeth the Lord." It's not about a "still, small voice" or some mystical gut feeling or "leading."

For most Christians and most circumstances, it's about two things: wisdom and faithfulness. Be wise in the choices you make, and be faithful with what God has already given you.

What's before you? What are you good at? What life experiences do you have? Where do those things naturally take you?

Don't wait around for another year for the Lord to give you some kind of a sign. He's revealed everything you need in his Word -- both his written word and the living Word, Jesus. You're not less of a Christian because you haven't heard the audible voice of God telling you where to go to college or what job to get or what girl to marry. Ecclesiastes 9:10 -- Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might. In other words, go! Get up, look around, put your hand to the plow and don't look back. God is sovereign, and his plans will prevail whether you go to college A or B, take this job or that one, or marry Susie or Mary. Do whatever God has put before you! And trust that his purposes will be accomplished as you step out in faith.

Blessings!

[18. Leah said the following at 7:01 PM on Sep 22:]

18

Obewan, I think (and Steve, correct me if I'm wrong) that the label of "permanently celibate" only applies to a person who chooses it for themselves. They choose to be celibate for life, and so they should carry out a celibate life of dedication to God.

Those who want to be married though, will never (and should never) think that they are, or will end up, "permanently celibate". Because they want to be married! I think it's that simple.

Kevin- try not to get all super-spiritual. Just ask yourself. "Do I want to get married?" Don't interrupt that question with things like "but what if God wants me to be single"- God will not place a desire for marriage within you if he wants you to be single. So all you need do is ask yourself, "do I want to get married?" If you do, then there's your answer. If you don't, and honestly think you could maintain a life of celibacy, there's your answer :)

[19. Max S said the following at 7:52 PM on Sep 22:]

19

Sarah P (#14) wrote:
> "I think the problem I have with
> that description of the "call to
> celibacy," Aurora, is that you can
> apply the same argument to any
> number of things, including
> alcoholism. "If I wasn't supposed
> to be an alcoholic, God would
> remove the urge to drink." "

I couldn't agree more. The idea that only those without sexual attraction have the gift of singleness presumes that virtue should always be easy and that God will fulfill all our desires in this life. Neither is biblical or true to life. Sometimes God wants us to struggle and wait.

[20. Rachael said the following at 8:30 PM on Sep 22:]

20

Kevin,

If you're praying and in the Word, perhaps you can just follow your heart and take advantage of the opportunities presented before you, provided doing so doesn't run contrary to Scripture.

God is more powerful than your decisions. What if you make the 'wrong' decision? God can still work through it. He can stop you.

A lot of what God wants of us is revealed through Scripture. Sure our particularly situation specifics aren't perfectly spelled out. But a lot of what God wants is clear. Beyond that, I'd say, make a decision and go for it. I should apply the last decision to myself as well.

God doesn't have to make things clear or unclear to us, but I recently prayed to God that if He not want (a circumstance that may happen) to make that very clear in the very near future. If He doesn't, I'll probably just make the decision. And if that's the wrong decision? Hopefully He'll make it clear after I make the decision before 'it's too late'.

At some point we just have to decide things and move forward...

[21. Kevin said the following at 8:05 AM on Sep 23:]

21

Pray? That's your answer? Maybe you didn't catch that part of my post, I DO pray. I pray a lot. I pray hard. How can I have an 'amazing' relationship with God when I'll pray things like, "God, I'm here. Do with me as you like. Lead me to do your will. Show me your plan for me. Know me. Help me to know you. Teach me. etc," and yet I'll still hear/feel nothing?

Jesus didn't instruct his listeners to "have an amazing relaionship with God." He said, "Do the will of my Father," and "love eachother as I have loved you."

I want to do the will of God, and I ask to do it. But I don't know what that will is. People will say they feel God calling them to do something, I hear it all the time. But I wonder if God is REALLY calling them to do something, or if they are just pinning Him onto something they think might be good. They hear all the other people in their church or youth group saying, "God called me to this and that and the other thing." So in order to keep from feeling left out they pick something they think is good or something that's convenient for them and say, "God called me to do this," in order to keep from feeling left out. It gives them security and makes them feel more comfortable with themselves. They say, "God put this on my heart." How do we know God really put it there? How do we know it's not just our mind putting it there? Mohammed believed Gabriel put the Quran in his heart. Joseph Smith, Jr. believed Moroni put the translation of the book of Mormon in his heart. The councils of Carthage, Rome and Trent all believed God put the true biblical canon in their hearts. Obviously, at least some of these people were mistaken.

I don't want to just think I'm being called to something, I want to know. But I don't know. I don't have a clue. And despite seeking it and asking for it for a very long time, not for my own sake, but so that God may be gorified, I haven't found it or received it. Have I been damned or something? Am I the only one in this boat? Are there others who feel the same way I do and are just too scared to admit it to themselves? Is there anyone who can offer more help than merely telling me to do what I'm already doing?

note: keep in mind that I AM (and have been) asking God for help and trusting in Him.

[22. Nickolina said the following at 8:14 AM on Sep 23:]

22

I became a Christian at 20, was sexually active & sporadically engaged at the time, and struggled with the whole celibacy idea for years. Not a struggle of intellect or conviction; a struggle of awakened desires that would not go back to sleep once I chose to be chaste!

I kept putting my desires to be married on the altar, & there are lots of tears in that statement. I asked God not to allow me to be married until I could be a real "helpmeet" and He kept closing the door to marriage in my pleading face for 10 years.

Now, I have been married for 25 years and can share a couple of points--

Both states, married or single, are referred to as "gifts" by Jesus. All gifts are given for the benefit of the Body of Christ and are not necessarily for the rest of your stay on earth. People die all the time, and that will include you or a spouse and could happen today. (Excellent motivation, by the way, to appreciate what God gives you every moment.)

Both states, married or single, require being dead to self and alive to Christ. If you aren't struggling with something being put on the altar, you aren't sharing His suffering or growing in His grace. Your sin nature is not compatible with anyone else's and marriage does not mean constant fulfillment.

Both states, married or single, are actually temporary because there is only one marriage in Heaven, that of Christ & His Bride... which includes you if you choose.

Both states, married or single, are dim reflections of eternity and are going to be baffling with times of blindness. This means you walk by faith and not by sight.

Learning to be content in whatever state you are in requires knowing God & His Word, which is true theology. Only truth sets us free, and He is Truth.

Theology isn't an intellectual exercise, it is knowing God & interacting with Him--"God-Logic", that which makes sense (ology=the study of) because of God (theos=God). The hidden choices you make in response to Him every day are where you serve, married or single.

[23. mary kate said the following at 9:09 AM on Sep 23:]

23

WONDERFUL post, nickolina! very encouraging and full of truth. thank you for sharing.

i have also had to put desires for marriage on the altar, almost daily! and yeah, a lot of times with a lot of tears. but the peace and joy that come from totally giving those desires to god are soooo worth it! now he's in control, and i don't worry about marriage anymore. i don't have to.

[24. Matt from DC said the following at 9:23 AM on Sep 23:]

24

Kevin,

If I may be so bold, I am going to say that prayer is not necessary at this point because God has spoken in His Word. I trust that you were honest when you wrote "...reading the entire bible through..." so I'll only provide you with summary and books/chapters to explain what the Bible has to say about marriage.

When God first created man he was alone and though morally perfect he lacked completeness. Adam needed a helper so God created Eve to this end to compliment Adam in every way - equal in worth, but different in role. This complimentary union that is rooted in creation and lived out through marriage. God made mankind two genders to be united for his glory in marriage. - Genesis 1-2.

Later, God sent a flood as judgment on mankind and all were killed except for eight people - Noah, his wife, their three sons, and their wives. When the flood had receded and Noah and family were out of the ark God reiterated the covenant that He made with Adam to Noah affirming his design for man and woman to marry. - Genesis 9.

To this day all of mankind is under the covenant that God made with our forefather Noah.

When Jesus came preaching and teaching he set the example of a single man dedicated to doing the will of the Father. This raised some obvious questions for early believers and Paul responds to them in 1 Corinthians. Also, in his first letter to Timothy about how to pastor, Paul includes instruction about marriage in light of the New Covenant. Even though there is a gifting that allows for a person to remain contentedly single all of his/her life it is not given to all.

Unless you know you have the gift of singleness (and it sounds like you don't) you're under the covenant given to Noah and you're designed to marry. Just like every day you have breath you're designed to glorify God.

Remember that you will never be alone because Jesus will be with you. From the moment you believed you were filled with the Holy Spirit and Jesus and the Father have come and made their home with you (John 14). You are well equipped. Not only did Jesus' work reconcile God and man, but also Jesus purchased from every tribe and tongue a people of his own - the church. He died that you could come to know Him, that your sin debt would be paid in full, and so that you would be adopted into His family. Are you involved in a local church? Are you serving according to your spiritual gifting? Are you part of that community of sanctified ones who have been called out of the world to a heavenly country? I hope you are. Finally, if you feel fear and anxiety and are not convicted of sin then it is the work of the enemy. Pay it no mind, pray to be strengthened from it, and keep on going. Do not despair because God does not act how and when you want. Know that when He acts and how He chooses to do so will always be the best whether it makes sense to us while it is happening does not matter.

[25. mary kate said the following at 9:25 AM on Sep 23:]

25

kevin....
i'm sorry. many of us, myself included, responded to with what may have felt like flippant, cure-all answers. pray! seek god!

yeah, you are doing those things. all i can say is that i agonized thru 'just tell me what to do! i will do whatever you want me to!!' types of questions for years, in reference to both wanting to be married and wanting a more fulfilling job.

i've been at the ad agency i work at for five years... since i started, i knew it was not what i wanted to do forever. i have tons of pages in my journals where i am crying out to god (and the pages are stained with tears) to tell me how to figure out what i should be doing. go back to school? work at another agency? work at starbucks? i couldn't understand why he wouldn't help me figure out what to do. i was putting myself in front of him, asking for answers, and saying, whatever the answers are, i'll take them!

after a lot of crying out, i was tired. and finally i felt like he was saying 'relax. seriously. you know i have a plan for you... my word tells you so. so just be with me, spend time with me, and know that i love you and will reveal things to you when the time is right. i think god sometimes just wants us to enjoy Him, enjoy being with him, instead of just wanting him to give us answers all the time.

so i relaxed, and focused on what he had given me; the job i have, the friends i have, the life i have. i made myself be content. and i started to feel a lot better.

and after a while of being content, and some time away on a mission trip to new orleans, i got what i'd been asking for; strong direction from god on where to go next. i'm probably quitting my job in january to go back to school to become an art teacher. in a few minutes, i'm leaving work to meet with an advisor at the school i'll go to. i'm soooo freaking excited!!!!!

obviously, that's an abridged version of how the last several years have been. feel free to contact me (click my name, it links to my blog) if you want to hear more.

hang in there. he will tell you! and when he does, you'll know. and unlike joseph smith et al, you'll know because you'll be able to back up what god is saying with scripture and your community of believers. think of it like a stool; your mission/your life needs to be supported by answers to prayer, scripture, and what solid believers who are close to you are saying. a stool needs three legs to be supported; just one or two, and it falls over. make sense?

praying for you!!!

[26. Tami said the following at 9:51 AM on Sep 23:]

26

I actually do see a flaw in Sarah P's analogy (14):

"If I wasn't supposed to be married, then God wouldn't have given me these desires" -- to me, this sounds like a prompt to seek God for what good gifts He desires to give. (I am assuming this person is also in obedience to God's will regarding living chastely NOW.)

"If I wasn't supposed to be an alcoholic, God would remove the urge to drink" -- this sounds like an attempt to excuse one's own sin. Alternately, it sounds fatalistic about one's propensity towards alcoholism.

Certainly, we can't always predict what God wants to give us. But I think we are obliged to seek what He would deem good for us. And yes, sometimes it is for us to wait. But those who desire marriage shouldn't lose hope, nor should they cease praying, simply because God might *not* answer in the exact way they hope or anticipate at the moment.

[27. Nickolina said the following at 10:01 AM on Sep 23:]

27

God's blindingly illuminating will....

I identify with Kevin! It would be so much easier to have GOD'S WILL lowered from heaven on a huge piece of paper, dangling from a fish hook like the old "Charlie Tuna" commercials (I reveal my age)...and I have done the coin toss to decide waaay too many things in my life, hoping it was sorta kinda like casting the lots in the OT.

It is hugely comforting to read in Scripture things like, "Who is so blind as Thy servant?" and "We are crushed, but not despairing...etc." He knows we are but dust, like Hobbits caught up in things beyond our Shire.

In my limited experience, I've seen that if I don't do His Will in the things I already know He wants my obedience in, being patient, trusting Him, forgiving someone, listening rather than planning my mini-sermon...then I have a harder time seeing His will in a choice.

What I generally do when facing a huge decision is pray for wisdom, choose what looks wisest, & ask God to close the door if it's not best. And I still have doubts afterward...but I must trust Him that if I was willing to hear His "NO" it was His "YES".

When you look at the history of His people, most of us wander around ignorant of His presence except for flashes of insight but that doesn't mean He's not there. Look at how Israel, despite the pillar of fire & cloud, complained in the wilderness!

I do that.

[28. IMO said the following at 12:09 PM on Sep 23:]

28

Nickolina-
It seems you would make a wonderful mentor to younger women! I hope you consider it (if you aren't already one).

[29. Sarah P. said the following at 12:35 PM on Sep 23:]

29

Kevin (#21) wrote: Pray? That's your answer? Maybe you didn't catch that part of my post, I DO pray. I pray a lot. I pray hard. How can I have an 'amazing' relationship with God when I'll pray things like, "God, I'm here. Do with me as you like. Lead me to do your will. Show me your plan for me. Know me. Help me to know you. Teach me. etc," and yet I'll still hear/feel nothing?

I had to take what would have been the last semester of my senior year off from college in order to go home and help my parents. My best friends graduated without me. It was tough. I went on long walks in the evening, and I spent a lot of time lying on my back in our backyard and crying to God -- asking what you're asking. "Where are you, Lord God? What do you want from me anyway?"

So one day I'm lying there praying this, and I ask, "Jesus, speak to me. Talk to me. I need to hear you!" And I wait, but nothing happens. No words. Except I look up and see the branch of a tree waving over my head. I think, "Who is holding the tree together? Jesus! He is holding it together; He is holding me together (Col. 1:17). That's where He is. He is right here, 'knowing' my every atom." And then I realize, God doesn't have to speak to me in audible words, simply because He already wrote down His words to me long before I was born.

The key item in this story is that God did answer my prayer. He spoke to me right then and there through the working of the Holy Spirit, who pulled the right words from Colossians into my mind in direct answer to my request to hear from God. There wasn't a lot of fanfare. Nothing dramatic. But He spoke, in response to prayer, through the simple medium of Scripture.

I don't know if that helps you. It is true, though. If you read your Bible and seek/pray for wisdom so that the Holy Spirit has something to use, and then pray for guidance, it will come. I guarantee it will come slower than you hope, but it will come.

[30. IMO said the following at 12:37 PM on Sep 23:]

30

"How can I have an 'amazing' relationship with God when I'll pray things like, "God, I'm here. Do with me as you like. Lead me to do your will. Show me your plan for me. Know me. Help me to know you. Teach me. etc," and yet I'll still hear/feel nothing?"

This reminds me of how I used to (and still do) pray for God to change me and make me like Christ...(actually pretty much like your prayer above)
And then I realized that I won't get my answers by "simply" praying about it.
For example, I'd pray for more patience. And instead of just getting patience from God, I'd get into situations throughout the day that would test my patience. God could use those circumstances throughout the day to grow my patience.
Or when I'd pray to be more loving toward others, I'd face hard-to-even-like people throughtout the day.

You get my drift.

If you are praying for God to reveal Himself to you..He has! In His Word. Through His Holy Spirit, which is in you. And through circumstances, difficulties, and trials. Basically, through experiences in life.

"I don't want to just think I'm being called to something, I want to know. But I don't know. I don't have a clue."

Is there something specific that you want to be called to?

I never got a "calling" from God. I don't think that's Biblical to say we'll all get this calling to do this or that.
When I was in college, I hated it. 100%. I REALLY wanted to be called into a ministry or missions to get out of going to school. But nothing happened. I graduated.

God requires us to be obedient to Him in the small things.

"And despite seeking it and asking for it for a very long time, not for my own sake, but so that God may be gorified, I haven't found it or received it. Have I been damned or something?"

I'm sorry, I'm confused by this comment.
What are you seeking?

Are you saying that God will only be glorified if you have found or received it?

Are you saying that you feel damned because God isn't being glorified?

How do you know God is not being glorified already?

[31. Sarah P. said the following at 12:58 PM on Sep 23:]

31

Tami (#26),

Quite possibly there is a flaw in that specific analogy. But I have noticed that sometimes people stay single their whole lives, even if they have strong desires for marriage/sex. I was wrestling with the question, do these people, who have remained celibate their entire lives, have the "gift of celibacy?" If not, then by extension they must have "missed God's will." That doesn't seem possible. Sometimes God even sends whales to swallow people, just to make His will happen. So then, celibacy must mean something else than simply not desiring sex. I like what the CT article says about celibacy being a consistent commitment, just like how marriage is a daily commitment.

[32. Sharlene said the following at 1:06 PM on Sep 23:]

32

Hey Kevin (#21)
I just want to encourage you to keep on praying and seeking. This is exactly what God has called us to do - seek his kingdom and his righteousness - so don't give up. I know that God is pleased with your desire to seek His kingdom and he wants us to come to Him persistently. Don't be discouraged if God doesn't tell you what your specific "calling" is. You already know what he desires – for us to love Him (ie obey His commands) and to love others. I know that when I pray and read the Bible, I am often convicted of my sin, and how I neglect to love Him and others. For example, I recognize that I have been selfishly caught up in my own world while neglecting to love my roommate selflessly while she is going through a tough time. It is through prayer like this that I know what God desires for me to do the next day – to love my roommate. To be honest, I have no idea what God has called me to long term (in a specific sense). Sometimes I struggle with that. But I find peace when I seek God day by day, knowing that even when I make mistakes he forgives me. The Christian walk is not easy, but take heart, it is through this time of hardship that God is molding you into the man of God that he has created you to be. Some passages I have found very helpful are Hebrews 12:1-12, Matthew 7:7-12.

[33. Kevin said the following at 1:38 PM on Sep 23:]

33

Thanks mary kate and Nickolina for being honest. You offered experience and advice that makes sense without making it sound like, "you're just not doing it right, you need to do this and this and this..." You helped, so thanks.

And btw, mary kate, I'm also from the midwest, a city. But sorry, I don't play much volleyball. ;)

[34. mary kate said the following at 1:52 PM on Sep 23:]

34

lol, kev :)

[35. Nickolina said the following at 3:14 PM on Sep 23:]

35

You are welcome, Kevin & thanks for the encouragement, people...

So many times advice begins to feel like it's coming from Job's friends, and that's sad. It's ironic that, at the end of Job when he sees God & that's enough ... he STILL doesn't get an explanation of what was going on. I hope he did when he died, because I'm hoping for explanations when I'm dead, too!

A lot of those dark times we just need to eat something & sleep a while, like Elijah after Mount Carmel when he was suicidal...but if someone told me I needed a snack & a nap when I was in the pit, I'd hit 'em.

[36. Jennifer said the following at 4:26 PM on Sep 23:]

36

Steve,

You've done your readers an incredible disservice by lauding the incoherent gobbledeegook of Marcy Hintz. No wonder Kevin is confused, with quotations like this:

"For Christians who know they should be set apart but believe they are called to marriage the more helpful context is the one Hintz touches on later in the article when she writes, 'While chastity binds married couples to a shared intimacy and singles to refrain from sex, both callings are self-sacrificing as well as self-giving, and both rise from an engagement of love and of faith.'"

What are you (and Hintz) trying to say here? That singles by choice for service are "set apart", or that all believing singles (involuntary ones included) are "set apart"? Because if it's the latter, muddling together all singles (voluntary, involuntary, avowed, circumstantial) in this way, as part of some specially "singled out" group of celibates is not helpful.

Yes, as believers (married or otherwise), we are "set apart". But I think describing all singles in this "set apart" language makes absolutely no sense to a group that too often gets "singled out", being made to feel separate or different from the larger body enough as it is.

Why can't we just stick with a "sola scriptura" approach to singleness? Like Paul and Christ, who spoke entirely in the practical language of choice. Paul in 1 Cor 7 stating the advantages and disadvantages, under what conditions those choices make sense, but making it even more clear that it's no sin what we chose -- and never, ever super-spiritualizing it.

In scripture, there is no "called to celibacy" (or even "called to marriage" for that matter). No "gift of singleness", no "gift of marriage. Singleness itself is never referred to as a calling or vocation (the latter being used to describe occupation or mission), marriage never something you have to wait to be "called to".

This does not mean that God's sovereign will is not at work. It simply means we are to use good sense in exercising the volition that God has given us vis a vis marriage and singleness, considering the gifts he has given us (ie. "containment", as per 1 Cor 7:4-9. There's far too much talk about divining God's will for our individual lives and not enough emphasis on simply obeying God's will as per the scriptures.

Having evangelical celibacy vows and hoopla for those single for a "season" or lifetime commitment will not solve the problems singles face in terms of public perceptions or private behavior. No more than teen sex will be solved by father-daughter purity pledges (or father-daughter purity lockets -- ewwww!).

Our good intentions to affirm those who have chosen celibate service should not exist at the expense of the larger number of singles who get understandably confused and anxious when terms like celibate and celibacy get applied to them. Even "chastity" has become convoluted as gets applied to everyone from the married to the avowed celibate to the "reborn virgin". I think abstinent is a better choice of word, when we are talking about obeying teachings about premarital sex -- without marriage, it's a commandment, not a "calling".

It's an unfortunate trend how showy writers like Marcy Hintz and Lauren Winner have been dressing up singleness and celibacy, muddling both together, waxing lyrical while approving academics look on. If Hintz's professor really wanted her to help singles, she would get her mind out of the "set them up for singleness" box and take more seriously the fact that most of that one fifth who never marry are not single by choice. We must stop glossing over these facts and start looking at the consequences.

Hintz complains that "Evangelical pastors justify the celibate life with those passages, but hardly ever promote it as a desirable calling" and suggests that "Though some churches may flinch from ordaining a celibate vow, we might still use the word celibacy to rightly honor and rightly name the countercultural life to which singles are called".

Does she not know that Christ in Matthew 19 reserved his teachings on celibacy only for those who can hear them? Like AA, celibate service as a life choice is something that should be sustained through attraction, not promotion, especially considering the anxiety it creates in those who do not want to be "celibate".

Steve, I apologize if the tone of my post is harsh, but Hintz' writings are a step backward for Boundless and I wish you'd taken a more critical stance. Perhaps you should re-read your wife's book!

[37. Jeremy said the following at 12:13 AM on Sep 24:]

37

Kevin, as way of encouragement, let me offer an insight that took me a long time to realize -- the Christian community uses phrases like God's call, or hearing from God, or God's direction, in ways that are completely unlike how those words would be used in any other context. Almost always, what someone who uses these phrases is referring to is a combination of emotion and opportunity (God led me to the mission field ... because I like missions and there was an organization accepting applications).

You are not missing anything essential! I have never heard the voice of God, I have never had him direct a decision in my life (directly). Indeed, even in Scripture, the record of God's work in human history, it is exceedingly rare for a person to even once in his life hear from God. So don't be discouraged, and don't feel the need to rely on hearing directly from God for decisions. What Scripture calls us to do is live according to God's commands, seek to grow in wisdom for decision making, and take responsibility for our choices.

[38. Rachael said the following at 10:07 AM on Sep 24:]

38

Kevin,

I responded to you in #20, but I'd like to add a bit. Please don't think you're weird for not feeling 'called' or that something might not be 'on your heart'.

Actually, I commend you for questioning things. And can I add that not every Christian everywhere talks like that. I wonder if you'd feel more comfortable in a different church, to be honest. If people around you are constantly talking about being "called" and their feelings, perhaps you'd simply feel more comfortable in another church. Please don't think something's wrong for not feeling so strongly about your "calling". Honestly, I would most likely feel uncomfortable and maybe skeptical if I was in a Christian community where people constantly talked about being "called", "led", and had things on their heart all the time.

I've been in a variety of denominations (including non-denominational) throughout my life, and I can tell you that not every Christian constantly talks like that. I don't. Not at all!!! I don't think I've ever said "I've been called to.........".

Now, many many years ago, probably when I was Jr. High age, I was with a youth group or something in a youth pastor's house. I think we were supposed to go around the room and say what we felt was on our heart or what Jesus was saying to us or something along those lines. If I'm not mistaken, I may have been told something like "It doesn't have to be a big impression or a clear voice" or something. I think I understood that, but I don't think I felt I had something specifically impressed upon my heart. Now, I may have ended up saying something, but if so, I probably just said it to appease and without thinking it was a direct message from God. It's just kind of weird to me how we were expected to be hearing from God or something. Thankfully, we ended up leaving that church and sought to go to a church that was more centered on Biblical teaching.

Sure, God can work in and through churches that are more touchy-feely, why not, but the touchy-feeliness should not overpower Scripture and what we know of God in the Bible.

We can't pigeon-hole God, put Him in a box, whatever you want to call it. We can't assume He'll always tell us "Do this specific thing, do that specific thing."

What we know we're supposed to do is already layed out in Scripture. Sure He can guide and impress stuff on our hearts. But we won't always have special feelings and see stars in the sky pointing to Bethlehem.

Last, here is a short article that starts with the question <"How does a person making decisions know what is the will of God?"

Best!

[39. Tami said the following at 11:27 AM on Sep 24:]

39

Jennifer (35) -- I am totally with you on Hintz's article, but I disagree about Lauren Winner. (I also don't think Steve is exactly advocating Hintz's point, but that's another matter.) Where do you see this in Winner's writing? I ask with genuine curiosity. If she promoted *celibacy* in the same way Hintz does, I would have been equally as turned off.

I've listened to Winner lecture in person a couple times, and have read her books and articles, and never got the sense that she was advocating singleness as a lifestyle choice, per se -- just that we don't view it as either a holding pattern where God has stuck us and left us isolated, or as an opportunity to engage in lustful (non-chaste) behavior.

The only similarity I see between Winner and Hintz is that Winner is trying to portray the unmarried as being as much of a part of the church as the married -- that we are all one body. I see no problem with this. I am unmarried (not by choice) and I am very much a part of my church. Nevertheless, as evidenced here, many others (also unmarried, not by choice) do feel marginalized in their own churches. This, indeed, is something that we have to address as the body: both by making sure *all* members of a church feel welcome, and by creating an atmosphere where marriage is encouraged as a blessing, but not idolized as a special state meant only for the chosen, where families are cordoned off from the not-married.

(As a general comment -- I agree with those who define chastity as a command for *all* believers, but celibacy as a vow or choice *deliberately taken up* by those who wish to serve God unhindered by the particular responsibilities of marriage and family. John Stott is a modern evangelical example of such a person. Agree with him on the particulars or not, you can't argue that he has not fully dedicated his life to Christian service.)

[40. Kevin said the following at 2:09 PM on Sep 24:]

40

Thanks for responding Jeremy and Rachael. I've got a bit to clarify to each of you though.

Jeremy: Emotion and opportunity are dangerous things to attribute to God, ESPECIALLY emotion. Those things can be so manipulated by a person. And a person can be so manipulated by those things. I'm definitely not going to start saying God led me to do something just because I felt emotional and opportunistic about it. That's like stealing God's giant stamp of approval and stamping things that come up that you feel emotionally drawn to. Especially when emotions change every day. I'm pretty sure it says somewhere in the bible that our hearts can deceive us. So if people are really doing as you say they are, then God's will is being controlled merely by people's emotions. And I for one don't trust that at all.

Rachael: "I wonder if you'd feel more comfortable in a different church, to be honest."

Maybe, but I don't go to church to feel comfortable. That's how people get deceived. That's exactly why Joel Osteen's church is so jam packed with thousands of people, they all go there to feel comfortable with themselves. And besides, this issue isn't caused merely by people in churches that I attend. You and I both know that it's a very common theme in the entire realm of christianity. And, I fear it's a theme that stems from the very explaination (emotion and opportunity) that Jeremy gave in #37.

I know we can't put God in a box, and I know that He's probably not gonna speak to me in a big booming voice with answers to all my questions. The thing that frustrates me is that, if He doesn't speak to me like that, how can I know that what I think is His calling really IS His calling, and not just my own emotions? How can I know it's not just my own deceitful heart and mind? I can't. And I'm not going to pin God's name to something just because I feel emotional about it.

[41. Jeremy said the following at 2:33 PM on Sep 24:]

41

Kevin (#40) -

You are exactly right, it is very dangerous; I think "stealing God's stamp of approval" is an excellent way to characterize that. It is sad that this seems to be such a prevalent misuse among many evangelicals, but the fact that you are keeping your focus on Scripture and questioning what might seem to be conventional thinking when it does not line up with God's word is an excellent thing. God bless!

[42. Sarah P. said the following at 3:23 PM on Sep 24:]

42

Kevin: Peace, brother. :)

Ecc. 11:9 - Rejoice, O young man, in thy youth; and let thy heart cheer thee in the days of thy youth, and walk in the ways of thine heart, and in the sight of thine eyes: but know thou, that for all these things God will bring thee into judgment.

What do you fear? What will happen if you go wrong? God will bring you back. There is no way to get through life without falling flat on your face a few times. It hurts. You learn.

I'm a juggler. We say, "Every drop is a sign of progress." That is because you only drop when you are trying things you can't do... yet. And that is what youth is for. :)

[43. Nickolina said the following at 4:00 PM on Sep 24:]

43

#36 said, "In scripture, there is no "called to celibacy" (or even "called to marriage" for that matter). No "gift of singleness", no "gift of marriage."

Matthew 19:11, Jesus says that not all men can accept the statement (better not to marry) but only those to whom it has been given.

Being given something=a gift.

I will grant the stretch in terms of marriage, except that Eve was given to Adam and the whole of Biblical reference to gifts is so compex that teaching on gifts varies according to church culture. It is clear, regardless of your defining of "giftedness", that you are part of the Body of Christ (once born again, as Jesus put it) and that not being obedient to serve Him in your areas of influence & responsibility (He mentioned food service in Matt 24:45) will cause the Body to suffer because you are not doing His will...

This applies to all of us, married or single, slave or free, Jew or Gentile, man or woman.

I agree that the final authority is God's Word.

And it is kind of funny to my warped sense of humor that we get so reactive to words like celibate, chaste, & abstinent when they pretty much mean the same thing.

[44. Leah said the following at 6:22 PM on Sep 24:]

44

Sarah P said I think the problem I have with that description of the "call to celibacy," Aurora, is that you can apply the same argument to any number of things, including alcoholism. "If I wasn't supposed to be an alcoholic, God would remove the urge to drink."

That's faulty reasoning. The key reason is that alcoholism is a sin; celibacy is not. We are all susceptible to sin; some a more susceptible to certain sins than others. We all have the urge to sin- we cannot say "If I wasn't supposed to sin, God would remove the urge to sin". Because we know for a fact that's false.

Celibacy and marriage are different though. Neither are sins that we might be "tempted" to. As Nickolina said, they are both gifts. God won't have you desiring one gift when he wants to you accept another. That's something I hope Kevin realises :)

[45. Jennifer said the following at 9:52 PM on Sep 24:]

45

Tami (39) writes: "I am totally with you on Hintz's article, but I disagree about Lauren Winner. (I also don't think Steve is exactly advocating Hintz's point, but that's another matter.) Where do you see this in Winner's writing?"

Through flowery doublespeak like this:

"What is chastity? One way of putting it is that chastity is doing sex in the body of Christ—doing sex in a way that befits the body of Christ, and that keeps you grounded, and bounded, in the community.."

The phrase "chastity is doing sex in the body of Christ" just smacks of the worst kind of bumpersticker flattery, rife within the modern American church. Talking about chastity as something the whole church (married, included) all practice together is just another hollow nicety to keep singles from feeling left out.

Chastity is chastity: obediently abstaining from premarital sex, period. And it's hard. She talks about chastity in marriage, thus muddling chastity and fidelity. But in reality, there is no parallel between the married who are having sex with their spouses obediently abstaining from adulterous sex and singles who obediently abstain from all sex. Putting us all in the same boat that floats on hoky metaphors doesn't make it any easier for singles, or marrieds for that matter.

Likewise, she invokes the image of chaste single being faithful to God, as one would be faithful to a spouse -- “God desires your person, your body, more than any man or woman ever will”. I think we should steer clear of substituting human relationships we are meant to have with notions of "God as lover", not because it's irreverant, because it's just not supported in the scriptures.

Her "chastity as spiritual discipline" is also dubious. Early Christians did not expect that young people first discipline themselves as chaste singles before considering marriage. They married you off in hurry, lest you be tempted into sin -- no need to test your mettle. Sexual restraint as spiritual maturity/discipline being a prerequisite to marriage is an entirely modern concept.

We can assume that over time chastity would require discipline, but the scriptures don't really treat it as a discipline unto itself that brings you closer to God (although marrieds have the option of abstaining during times of fasting, as per 1 Cor 7:4-5), although its sinful violation would move you further from Him. God may be pleased and blessing us when we avoid sin, and appreciate the sacrifice of a celibate path of Christian service. But nowhere does the Bible speak of refraining from sex (for marrieds or for singles eschewing marriage) in terms of purification, which she comes dangerously close to suggesting.

Elsewhere, Winner drags up the usual "called to singleness/not called to marriage" lingo, with prim warnings not to make marriage into an "idol". So all her hipness, she's really just parroting the platitudes of those "gift of singleness" biddies who shall remain nameless.

[46. Rachael said the following at 10:41 PM on Sep 24:]

46

I second Jeremy (41)'s comment that "but the fact that you are keeping your focus on Scripture and questioning what might seem to be conventional thinking when it does not line up with God's word is an excellent thing."

And honestly, I do not hear people talking about God calling to things all the time and haven't for quite some time. My guess is that if you're hearing people talk like that all the time they are part of church communities that focus on stuff that is different from my church community.

My link to an article about God's will didn't come through in my last comment. Here is the website. And just for kicks, here is another article about God's Will.

Keep up the critical thinking, with humility.

[47. Rachael said the following at 10:43 PM on Sep 24:]

47

One more, Kevin, then I retire (hopefully). About the comfortable comment. Clarification: I should have said: "Theologically comfortable". I think it's okay to pay attention to emotions (uncomfortability) when "Christianese"ish stuff isn't necessarily Biblical.

[48. Sarah P. said the following at 8:04 AM on Sep 25:]

48

OK, I have the 'alcoholism' analogy sorted out. The original argument for a call to celibacy basically states, "If you have a desire to have sex and intimacy, then you are called to have sex and intimacy appropriately (through marriage) at some time in your life."

You can prove this false by negating the consequent. There are people who are apparently not called to have these things appropriately through marriage. Yet they still desire(d) them. So the argument in the first paragraph doesn't hold up.

Alcoholism is a sin; so is sex outside of marriage. However, neither alcohol nor sex is wrong in itself. The alcoholic, however, must not give in to the temptation to drink, just as the single person cannot give in to the temptation to have sex.

So the point is that we all have desires, some good, some bad. But a desire itself is not enough for us to say, "Oh, God wants me to do X." In the case of marriage, I think it is more God-honoring to say, "I want to get married, and holy marriage is something that God blesses." I hope that makes more sense - sorry for the long explanation.

[49. Nickolina said the following at 2:23 PM on Sep 25:]

49

Proverbs 27:7--"A sated man loathes honey, but to a famished man any bitter thing is sweet."

In my Bible, years ago, I wrote this in the margin beside this verse--"If I am not content in the Lord, I'll be tempted to "be content" filling the gap with food, attention, fantasy--and if He has not already filled me those comparatively bitter things are sweet. But if I'm content in Him I will not idolize."

Reading the reactions to "celibacy" in these posts, I see a depth of emotion that brought those years of singleness to mind. Now I am married, and would like to point out that being married does not mean you never again feel alone, rejected, unfulfilled, or sexually frustrated.

I have a very good marriage, but he's human & so am I. We need Jesus: "happily ever after" is for fairy tales unless you're talking about heaven.

[50. Jennifer said the following at 4:18 PM on Sep 25:]

50

Nickolina said : "#36 said, "In scripture, there is no "called to celibacy" (or even "called to marriage" for that matter). No "gift of singleness", no "gift of marriage."

Matthew 19:11, Jesus says that not all men can accept the statement (better not to marry) but only those to whom it has been given.

Being given something=a gift."

The problem with your interpretation is that it assumes that singleness itself is the gift. And it overlooks verse 12, Jesus identifies three types of eunuchs, two of the involuntary variety (those born eunuchs and those made eunuchs by men), as contrasted to the third, who voluntarily "made themselves eunuchs" for the sake of the kingdom.

Note that the first type of eunuch, "so born from their mother's womb", is not described as being made that way by God. This is not to dispute God's sovereignty but to note what the Bible does and does not refer to as a gift or provision of God. Indeed, being in the second case, would certainly have been considered an unfortunate affliction in Bible times, and they both have something in common: neither had any choice in the matter. The whole point of the teaching emerges when he presents the third kind of eunuch, those who MADE THEMSELVES eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom. It is plain to see that Christ is making a distinction between those who have no choice (and would probably never have made such a choice) from those who can choose to sacrifice marriage and all its connubial benefits to fulfill a mission.

Christ then concludes this verse by stating A SECOND TIME the conditions he set in verse 11, reiterating clearly that it is for those capable of receiving it (rather than obeying under compulsion or command from God): Dunamai choreo choreo (He that is able to receive (it), let him receive (it).

So, the gift is being able to receive or hear such a teaching, NOT SINGLENESS ITSELF. Calling involuntary singleness a gift is not helpful, and it doesn't fit with the scriptural narratives on singleness.

I agree that we are to be part of the Body of Christ and to serve Him in obedience and gratitude, regardless of your life situation. But what you do and do not call a gift DOES matter. Look up the word "gift" in the concordance of any bible and you'll see that positive things are called "gifts" and nowhere are negative or adversive things (like illness and infertility) called gifts (even if God can use those things to His glory).

Even if you've been given something by God, doesn't mean it's a gift. We don't call the Ten Commandments as gift, we call it law. We don't call punishment a gift (even if it is in our best interest), it would be cheeky to do so because it obscures God's intentions. Perhaps many of our generation are single, not as a gift, but as a consequence of personal and collective choices. In the past few decades, the insistence that the growing number of singles in the church are single because God "gifted" them that way has actually led to an avoidance of why so many aren't finding their way to marriage. Too many people end up pretending they are content, when they are (understandably) not.

A few of us because concerned about the roots of this problem coming from the proliferation of the "gift of singleness" teachings of the past few decades. This phrase was actually an embellishment of the Living Bible of the 70's (now the NLT), that caught on among singleness writers, becoming somewhat of a rogue doctrine. A few of us became fed up the fact that not only was in not in the original Greek text, but with how it caused so many people to doubt whether or not God was on their side about the goodness of pursuing marriage. So we got together and successfully campaigned to the NLT to have it removed! HALLELUJIAH, IT'S GONE!!

[51. Leah said the following at 7:09 PM on Sep 25:]

51

Jennifer, while I agree with most of your post, I think you go a little off-course when you suggest that chastity is not faithfulness to God like fidelity is faithfulness to a spouse. I heartily agree that we should "steer clear of substituting human relationships we are meant to have with notions of "God as lover"". However, I also think that chastity is faithfulness to God. Any sort of obedience is. When we are obedient to him, we are faithful to him; forsaking all others for his sake. That's what faithfulness is; that's what we practice when we obey God, and it's what we practice when we are loyal to our spouse.

Sarah P said
You can prove this false by negating the consequent. There are people who are apparently not called to have these things appropriately through marriage. Yet they still desire(d) them. So the argument in the first paragraph doesn't hold up.

That makes no sense. Where are these people who do desire sex and intimacy, but who are not called to marriage? How do you know they desire these things? How do you know they are not called to marriage? Perhaps they are but have just ignored it, not wanting the responsibility or commitment.

Your entire argument has no foundation whatsoever. You are stating things as fact when they have no grounding whatsoever.

Show me where the bible talks about, or where in society there are, people who desire sex/intimacy without being called to marriage.

NB: I don't really believe this whole "called to" stuff anyway. In my books, if you desire sex and intimacy, it's quite clear God wants you to marry. Of course you must control those urges until marriage, but it's still on the books for you. God would not give you those desires if he never intended you to fulfil them.

You can NOT equate this with the alcoholism argument. You do not just "have" alcoholic desires- you develop alcoholism yourself by your sinful nature. Do you know anyone who desires to drink themself into oblivion who has never drunk alcohol before? No. Do you know anyone who desires sex and intimacy who has never had it before? Most definitely!

[52. electric_bonzai said the following at 8:09 PM on Sep 25:]

52

What about us who have no "call" to celibacy, but are just asexual?

[53. Eliana said the following at 2:21 AM on Sep 26:]

53

In response to those who say that everyone is under a convenant of Adam and Eve or Noah and must marry, we should remember that Jesus said: "Jesus replied, "Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it." (Matt. 19:11–12). If a marriage convenant from Adam and Noah exists and is still in force, why isn't Jesus condemning these men for not marrying?

There does appear to be some confusion between the terms chaste and celibate. Celibacy, as someone has already mentioned, is a chosen state with vows and only applies to members of the church who have vowed it. Chastity, on the other hand, applies in various ways to all members of the church, married or unmarried.

Celibacy was common in the early church, as some of the best-known Roman martyrs were consecrated virgins, meaning that they had vowed celibacy for life. The best known of these were Saints Thecla (lived in 1st century AD and reputed to be follower of Saint Paul's teaching on celibacy), Agnes (291-304 AD), Perpetua and Felicity (early 200's), Agatha (died 251 AD), Cecilia (died between 176-180 AD), and Lucy (283-304 AD). From the lives of these martyrs and others, it can be seen that the early church did esteem celibacy as a legitimate call from God and worthy of lifelong vows, just as a marriage is a vow that lasts as long as both spouses live.

[54. Mike Theemling said the following at 10:16 AM on Sep 26:]

54

Interesting article but after reading it I'm not sure it's very helpful.

I'll start out with the positives first though. It is good that it acknowledges that singles is a real and pertinent issue and does not belittle or try to shame those who desire marriage as "weak" or "not trusting enough". It also does point out that one ought to make the best use of his/her circumstances and to serve the Kingdom now rather than waiting for marriage to happen first.

However, I do believe that this article puts celibacy (as in lifelong single living) on too high of a pedestal. As if it's something that we should strive for or attain rather than just simply accept if circumstances produce it.

The reason why I'm not a big fan of espousing (no pun intended) the "religious order way of living" (vows or no vows) is that quite frankly in many cases it doesn't work. Look at the Roman Catholic Church priesthood (and my apologies in advance, I'm not trying to demonize them but I believe it is a fair example). Right now you have a severe shortage of priests, and of those you do have, you undoubtedly have a number who struggle immensely with their sexuality to the point of releasing it in unhealthy ways. With women I believe the problem is under better control, but that does not mean it should be something practiced.

The article talks about Paul being single and his wishing that "everyone were like he was". However, most scholars agree that Paul probably was at one time married as that was a mandate (or at least a very strong push) of Benjamite priesthood. And Paul himself called himself a "Hebrew of Hebrews". Most likely his wife either died or left him because of his conversion. The point should not be that "Jesus/Paul was single so we ought to be too" but rather despite our circumstance, we should still serve God. Desiring/pursuing a spouse does not negate that.

It is true that the Bible does say that the celibate life is higher, special calling because of one's sole devotion to pleasing God rather than God and family. However, Jesus said that those "who can accept this should accept it". I would argue that most can't accept it and it's nothing to be ashamed over.

And that's the "problem" with the Church today in America regarding this issue. Rather than try to remedy the problem by encouraging marriage and spiritual development in preparation towards it we discourage it ("Wait for God to provide someone", "Focus on Him", and other true yet feckless soundbites). The message here seems to imply, "Since so many people will end up single anyway" let's encourage more of them to consider lifelong celibacy." This I believe is a mistake that will only backfire. Fact of the matter is most people DO want to be a loving, meaningful marriage relationship (maybe the age at which that realization comes is later, but it still comes to just about everyone).

Just my thoughts.

[55. Jennifer said the following at 10:22 AM on Sep 26:]

55

Nickolina said : "#36 said, "In scripture, there is no "called to celibacy" (or even "called to marriage" for that matter). No "gift of singleness", no "gift of marriage."
Matthew 19:11, Jesus says that not all men can accept the statement (better not to marry) but only those to whom it has been given.
Being given something=a gift."

The problem with your interpretation is that it assumes that singleness itself is the gift Jesus was referring to. And it overlooks verse 12, where Jesus identifies three types of eunuchs, two of the involuntary variety (those born eunuchs and those made eunuchs by men), as contrasted to the third, who voluntarily "made themselves eunuchs" for the sake of the kingdom.

Note that the first type of eunuch, "so born from their mother's womb", is not described as being made that way by God. This is not to dispute God's sovereignty but to note what the Bible does and does not refer to as a gift or provision of God. Indeed, being in the second case, would certainly have been considered an unfortunate affliction in Bible times, and they both have something in common: neither had any choice in the matter. The whole point of the teaching emerges when he presents the third kind of eunuch, those who MADE THEMSELVES eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom. It is plain to see that Christ is making a distinction between those who have no choice (and would probably never have made such a choice) from those who can choose to sacrifice marriage and all its connubial benefits to fulfill a mission.

Christ then concludes this verse by stating A SECOND TIME the conditions he set in verse 11, reiterating clearly that it is for those capable of receiving it (rather than obeying under compulsion or command from God): Dunamai choreo choreo (He that is able to receive (it), let him receive (it).

So, the gift is being able to receive or hear such a teaching, NOT SINGLENESS ITSELF. Calling involuntary singleness a gift is not helpful, and it doesn't fit with the scriptural narratives on singleness.
I agree that we are to be part of the Body of Christ and to serve Him in obedience and gratitude, regardless of your life situation. But what you do and do not call a gift DOES matter. Look up the word "gift" in the concordance of any bible and you'll see that positive things are called "gifts" and nowhere are negative or adversive things (like illness and infertility) called gifts (even if God can use those things to His glory).

Even if you've been given something by God, doesn't mean it's a gift. We don't call the Ten Commandments as gift, we call it law. We don't call punishment a gift (even if it is in our best interest), it would be cheeky to do so because it obscures God's intentions. Perhaps many of our generation are single, not as a gift, but as a consequence of personal and collective choices. In the past few decades, the insistence that the growing number of singles in the church are single because God "gifted" them that way has actually led to an avoidance of why so many aren't finding their way to marriage. Too many people end up pretending they are content, when they are (understandably) not.

A few of us because concerned about the roots of this problem coming from the proliferation of the "gift of singleness" teachings of the past few decades. This phrase was actually an embellishment of the Living Bible of the 70's (now the NLT), that caught on among singleness writers, becoming somewhat of a rogue doctrine. A few of us became fed up the fact that not only was in not in the original Greek text, but with how it caused so many people to doubt whether or not God was on their side about the goodness of pursuing marriage. So we got together and successfully campaigned to the NLT to have it removed! HALLELUJIAH, IT'S GONE!!

[56. Jennifer said the following at 11:46 AM on Sep 26:]

56

Hi Leah,

I agree that any kind of obedience is a kind of faithfulness to God, but I think that's a different kind of faithfulness (just as there are different kinds of love, ie. agape, eros, etc.)

[57. Nickolina said the following at 12:45 PM on Sep 26:]

57

in reply to #50--

I am glad you brought your study of the original language into your post, God's word has final authority.

The ability to "receive" a teaching may well be what Jesus was referring to in that instance, but does that negate a view of giftedness including all you have been given? What have you NOT been given, in truth?

The label "gift" applies to far more than temporary pleasure, and all things work together for ultimate good (Romans 8). It does not seem a stretch to put all our circumstances and limitations and, dare I say, even sins into His hands & trust Him to use all for His glory & our good since that is His promise.

However, changing the label of "gift" doesn't change our responsibility. I've heard various teaching on "gifts" and have come to the conclusion that it's an area that causes sidetracking because the edges are fuzzy. I should've thought of that before I used the term!

[58. Sarah P. said the following at 1:24 PM on Sep 26:]

58

Leah (#51): I don't really want to argue for the sake or arguing, but I appreciate being challenged on things that may be incorrect. Let me clarify my thoughts a little and see if that helps.

I was making fundamental theological assumptions, as follows:
(1) If God calls you to do something, you will do it, because He is sovereign. (And the way you know this "call" is because of where you are right now. That's where you're called to be.)
(2) Some people who desire marriage nonetheless do not get married.
(conclusion) Therefore, some people who desire marriage are not called by God to marriage.

I am coming to peace with the realization that I may desire lots of things in this life, but God has not promised I will get them here. If and when I get married, it will be an amazing gift, not something that I am guaranteed because of my heart's loneliness.

OK, so it looks like "alcoholism" isn't a good analogy. I think the points underlying the attempted analogy are still sound, however. :)

[59. Jennifer said the following at 4:09 PM on Sep 26:]

59

Nickolina (49) wrote: "Reading the reactions to "celibacy" in these posts, I see a depth of emotion that brought those years of singleness to mind. Now I am married, and would like to point out that being married does not mean you never again feel alone, rejected, unfulfilled, or sexually frustrated...I have a very good marriage, but he's human & so am I. We need Jesus: "happily ever after" is for fairy tales unless you're talking about heaven."

I'm not sure that you understand. In the decades since your wedding, the marriage rates (especially among devout Christian women) have been declining. What you are hearing is a collective response to something that is pretty much a global problem among evangelical women, many of whom will never marry or have children due to the shortage of men in the church that has worsened over the past few decades. These singles are not idolators, lacking in faith -- justifiably worried about something that is real. God has designed women to worry about time slipping away -- it's called the biological clock! Yes, we are to have faith, but faith does not mean that by having genuine human emotions that they are somehow idolizing or idealizing marriage.

Candice Watters, one of the writers here at Boundless wrote about why those helping marriage-minded singles shouldn't be so quick to bring out the contentment sermons and reminders not to make marriage an idol, aptly pointing out that no one seems to tell singles not to make their careers into an a idol! This article is available in the Boundless archives (Marriage, An Idol?)

[60. Adam said the following at 12:47 PM on Sep 27:]

60

Jennifer,

This phrase was actually an embellishment of the Living Bible of the 70's (now the NLT), that caught on among singleness writers, becoming somewhat of a rogue doctrine. A few of us became fed up the fact that not only was in not in the original Greek text, but with how it caused so many people to doubt whether or not God was on their side about the goodness of pursuing marriage. So we got together and successfully campaigned to the NLT to have it removed! HALLELUJIAH, IT'S GONE!!

Why do you continue to propigate this story? You know what the translators themselves said, and yet you continue to believe this? For those who are interested, I know one of the translators of the NLT, and I asked him about this. His response was interesting. You can read all of the relevant documentation here:

http://puritancalvinist.blogspot.com/2008/04/reports-of-death-of-gift-of-singleness.html

Notice, all Jennifer could do in response to this in the comments section is just say "whatever." The reality is that the NLT translators changed nothing in the text because they agreed with Jennifer and those who wrote them. They did reconsider the passage, and found that, though the text is referring to singleness as a gift, it is way to narrow to translate it as "gift of singleness" because it breaks up the connection between this discussion and Paul's later discussion of spiritual gifts. In fact, if you look at the link I gave, they specifically disagree with Jennifer's interpretation of this passage. The only thing with which they agreed is that this text cannot be used to force someone to remain single, something that no one ever taught in the first place!

Jennifer also says it is not "in the Greek." Again, what is meant by that. If you mean it is not a literal translation of the Greek, then she would be correct. However, neither is "speak kindly to Jerusalem" a literal translation of Isaiah 40:2. It literally reads "speak to the heart of Jerusalem." This is one of the issues in translation. All translations are, in some sense of the word, an interpretation. The question is how literal should you be in your translation, since, as is the case with Isaiah 40:2, if you are too literal, some of the meaning might be lost.

As I understand it, originally, the NLT translators wanted to emphasize that singleness is being called a gift in this passage. However, while making revisions for the current edition of the NLT, they realized that, by translating it in this fashion, it broke up the theme of spiritual gifts which runs throughout the end of 1 Corinthians. That is the delemma that confronted the translators of the NLT when they were reconsidering this passage. Hence, nothing whatsoever was changed because of anything Jennifer and those who wrote the NLT translators said, and to say that this change was made as a result of their "campaigning" is simply wrong.

In fact, Nickolina, you should know that Jennifer does not know Greek. Even this very post proves that, as she said that the Greek reads:

Dunamai choreo choreo

Actually, the Greek reads:

ho dunamenos chorein choreito

Another good example is this:

Look up the word "gift" in the concordance of any bible and you'll see that positive things are called "gifts" and nowhere are negative or adversive things (like illness and infertility) called gifts (even if God can use those things to His glory).

You need to understand that, when you do this, you ignore all of the language that can be used to convey the concept of a "gift" that is not actually the word "gift" itself. A good example of this is the term "trinity." All orthodox Christians believe God is a trinity, and yet, the specific term is not in the Bible. Consider if someone wanted to argue that we need to be careful about what we call a trinity, since the Bible never calls God a trinity. Now, wouldn't we all agree that such would be fallacious?

As far as these things being a gift, here is the language of gift applied in the context of evil things that happen in our lives, as well as good things:

Lamentations 3:37-38 Who is there who speaks and it comes to pass, Unless the Lord has commanded it? 38 Is it not from the mouth of the Most High That both good and ill go forth?

And, Nickolina brought up the classic passage in this regard:

Romans 8:28 And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose.

I just simply wanted to put this out there for people so that they know both sides of this, and decide for themselves. Often, when we hear Greek being thrown out there, and we hear that someone convinced a translator of something, our critical reasoning shuts down, and it should not. We need to be careful and discerning even when someone is throwing out Greek, and talking about translators. I hope that the reader will do just that.

God Bless,
Adam

[61. Michele said the following at 9:04 AM on Sep 28:]

61

For Kevin: I was listening to a pastor this week who often counsels college students asking about this very issue. (Not knowing God's will for their lives)

He will ask them "Well, what DO you know?"

In other words, maybe you don't know your vocation, or whether or not you'll marry, but you do know something about God's will - He has given us all commands in the Bible. What's the last thing you felt convicted on? Often, these students will realize there is some way they can bring their lives more in harmony with the Word of God.

Go back to the last thing God clearly told you, - a Bible text you read, a conviction, something that your conscience told you, unbiased counsel from a godly friend.

Even if it seems trivial, or easy, or unimportant.

I'm not making assumptions about your Spiritual walk; I think everyone, including myself needs to do this. We humans tend to neglect what God has already given us.

If God does not answer a question, it is often because He is waiting for you to pay attention to something He has already told you, OR it is not His will to answer your question just yet, because the answer will not help you right now. Often, it is a combination of both.

Not knowing you, and not being God, I can't tell you if you are doing something wrong or if God is simply saying "Wait."

But God has not predestined you for Hell, nor does He just enjoy watching you being confused.

John 16:12-13: "I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth..."

James 1:5 says, If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives liberally to all without finding fault.

God wants to answer you, but you may not be able to handle the answer to the questions you're asking right away.

Imagine a scenario for a second. (This is purely my imagination, so the details aren't important)

What if God's will is something like "Spend ten years in marketing, 2 years as as shoe salesmen, and then die as a martyr after being a missionary for three months?"

If something like that WAS God's will, do you really need to know that today?

God could be asking you to do the best you can in the job you have now, NOT tell you about the marketing job until you get offered it, NOT tell you that you are going to work there for TEN years, (not 20 or five years) until you find yourself as a shoe salemen, and then NOT tell you you're going to be a missionary until two years later, and then, when He calls you as a missionary, not mention the part about being a martyr.

You see where I'm going with this? The only part of your calling or destiny you would know in this scenario, is what you doing right at the moment. Be the best shoe salemen or marketer or missionary, or whatever you are right now. Along the way, there will be many little opportunities to share the love of God, opportunities that may not seem big or important, but which may have eternal consequences for someone involved.

The only time you would HAVE to know your calling, is when you are faced with a decision to be made right now.

Even then, God may lead through circumstances, and not a direct revelation.

The opportunities God has put in front of you now ARE His calling on your life. When He wants you to make some life-altering decision, He'll let you know.

Look at James 4:13-17. Sometimes God does not want us to plan too far ahead; He may not even plan for us to be alive tomorrow. That's okay. What God wants us to do is those good things we know we ought to do. He will unfold the big plans as we need to know them.

[62. Leah said the following at 5:36 PM on Sep 28:]

62

Jennifer- I think I see what you're saying, but I think there are bigger differences between the different loves than faithfulnesses. Faithfulness, whether to God or spouse, is staying loyal to that person and keeping yourself for them. I think that is what people would mean when saying that being faithful to God is like being faithful to a spouse. You're being loyal to them and keeping yourself for them.

Mike Theemling - I understand where you're coming from in regards to Catholic priests. However, I don't think you can quite equate that with basic celibacy. I think that a priest, first and foremost, is choosing that profession because he wants to be a priest. The celibacy is a requirement that follows. I would completely agree that this requirement should be unnecessary. However if someone were to choose celibacy for its own merits and because they have no desire for sexual intimacy, I think that's another matter.

In the first instance, you are far more likely to have people being "caught" in the celibate lifestyle when celibacy itself was never what they really wanted. In the second instance, you are far less likely, because these people have specifically chosen celibacy.

I could be wrong of course, but that's my impression.

[63. Jennifer said the following at 5:38 PM on Sep 29:]

63

"The reality is that the NLT translators changed nothing in the text because they agreed with Jennifer and those who wrote them."

The reality is that the NLT changed their translation of 1 Cor 7:7, which used to read..

..."But I wish everyone were single, just as I am. But God gives to some the GIFT OF MARRIAGE, and to others the GIFT OF SINGLENESS."

...to now read: "But I wish everyone were single, just as I am. Yet each person has a special gift from God, of one kind or another."

Upon making this change, the NLT editors notified us and sent each one of us complimentary copies of the latest NLT edition -- which speaks volumes about their responsiveness to ordinary, lay readers who bring up concerns about their modern interpretations of the text!

About Adam's post...we corresponded with NLT editors about his claims and were assured that he took their words out of context. In a nutshell, they don't see all singleness as a gift anymore than we do, particularly when it's a "thorn in the flesh" (their words) for so many these days. Yet they do respect that some single individuals may have a "special gift of God", like Paul, as stated in their new translation. As such, they noted the old version could be misinterpreted and generalized to all singleness, which was never their intention. Therefore they were quite happy to change it -- fine with us, we didn't need a big theological explanation, we were just glad they did it.

[64. Leah said the following at 11:11 PM on Sep 29:]

64

Jennifer, can I point out how very wrong you are to say God has designed women to worry about time slipping away.

God clearly says that we should not worry. To worry indicates a lack of trust in God, which is sin. "Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life?"

Yes, we should be aware of our time limit in regards to getting married (as you said, our biological clock). Being aware is not the same as worrying.

Sarah P- I took issue with the alcoholism analogy because I thought that rather than explain the points, it clouded the issue and was misleading. I wasn't trying to argue for arguments' sake :)

I am still puzzled by your assumption that Some people who desire marriage nonetheless do not get married.
As I said in my last post, can you provide biblical or social examples of this? I won't go so far as to say outright that you are wrong, but I have not seen any evidence to support that idea. I know that God does not always give us our heart's desires, but in pretty much all those cases you can point to a bible passage that still explains the time of waiting or suffering that you're experiencing. There is no such evidence in the bible that God would permanently withhold marriage from someone who desired it (that I have read).

[65. Nickolina said the following at 6:58 AM on Sep 30:]

65

In response to #59 and the idea of marriage being an "idol", every time I am disappointed in a situation it is because I had idealized my own scenario for it. And quite often, when my emotions are tied to the outcome of my scenario, I realize that I'm guilty of idolatry; expecting that earthly thing to satisfy a permanent need that only God fills.

Having better hindsight than foresight, I see the perspective later. It is not that emotions are bad: Jesus was able to express His feelings about the coming crucifixion freely without sin. The trick is "not my will but Thine". I visualize the process like that of holding my hand out the window while driving...as long as my hand is open, it feels full. When I try to grasp the wind, it feels empty. That grasping is a picture of what I do when I idolize.

Married people can idolize singleness, imagine that! We all are a bunch of idolaters, in truth.

And I must point out that this generation of single women is not the first to have a dearth of potential mates and that each heart's pain makes it feel alone regardless of statistics.

[66. Jennifer said the following at 1:13 PM on Sep 30:]

66

Leah writes "Jennifer, can I point out how very wrong you are to say God has designed women to worry about time slipping away...God clearly says that we should not worry. To worry indicates a lack of trust in God, which is sin. "Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life?"

Yes, I'm familiar with that passage, Leah. But it certainly is not a claim that all worry is sin, or that anyone is capable of living without worry, fear, anger, grief, or any other emotions that are part of the affective spectrum and have important functions in keeping us alive. When you declare a sin something that is so universal (especially with such limited biblical support), you do more harm than good. It is inevitable that certain emotions be tied to certain outcomes -- can you imagine not feeling grief for the death of a beloved husband or child? Singles also feel grief, as years go by and doors for having children of their own become shut forever. No amount of prayer or admonishments amieliate this kind of grief, which like a cut, must always heal at the pace of its own divine design.

About "idolatry", another harmful concept when overapplied and overused...

...In her "Marriage, An Idol?" article, Candice Watters wrote the following:

"But today there's an added reason women hide their desire for marriage. They've been told and retold that nurturing such a desire will not only scare men off, but worst of all, it may lead them to idolatry. I see and hear this warning a lot among Christians. It seems anytime someone writes or preaches about marriage to singles, they start with the caveat that wanting marriage is good 'as long as you don't make an idol out of it.' Can the desire for marriage really become an idol? It's technically possible. But that notion has been blown out of proportion. And repeatedly suggesting the possibility of idolatry has done more harm than good. It's caused a lot of women to be tepid in their approach to marriage and made them afraid that any amount of thinking or acting on their desire might be a sin. Both have the unfortunate consequence of making marriage even less likely to happen."

She goes on to say that in the scriptures, idolatry is a serious charge, something that you don't take lightly. But it's become almost a knee jerk response to singles who express any desire for marriage -- not that anyone ever uses this lable to describe those who are driven in terms of career!

Even on Boundless today, there's an article "Mind the Single-minded Church", that speaks to this issue:

"One single man, quoted in Julia Duin's Quitting Church, talked about his experience of telling his small group that he wanted to get married,

I' was rebuked by the elders because, according to them, the Bible says it is better to be single to serve God better. They, obviously, were married, and I didn't understand, if they felt so strongly about being single, why they themselves weren't single. When I would ask for prayer, I would get a lecture about being content, and was told I needed to stop focusing on self and serve God better.'

Duin noted how, during research for her book, she "kept running into stories about ministers who were indifferent about singles issues until their own children began looking for mates." The pastor she spotlighted did little to nothing to match the singles in his church body, even as he "went about the church, telling everyone how wonderfully God had answered their [family's] prayers [for a husband for his daughter].... The incident caused quite a stir among the single women in that church," she said.

While references to being content in singleness might make singles feel more comfortable in the short term, in the long term, they're a disservice to singles who desire to marry well."

The rest of the article illustrates why it's important to respond meaningfully to this generation of grieving Christian singles who missed out on marriage. "There's more to life than marriage, marriage is hard" is fine for the very young, but those who are looking around themselves at the reality of declining marriage rates (which get worse with each year), WE MUST DROP THE USUAL CLICHES AND PLATITUDES, if our witness is to be genuine.

[67. Sarah P. said the following at 2:09 PM on Sep 30:]

67

Leah (#64): There is no such evidence in the bible that God would permanently withhold marriage from someone who desired it (that I have read).

Hmm. Emily Dickinson? heh. Or after big wars in which many millions of men died. One would have to assume that millions of women in turn did not find husbands. A double tragedy. How about folks who die in their teens or twenties?

People have had to have legs amputated who definitely didn't want that. People have been born blind who would have liked to see. People have lost new spouses in sudden tragedy only a few weeks after marriage. I no longer assume anything about life. I very much want to be married at some point, but I don't think this desire guarantees marriage. It certainly doesn't guarantee a good marriage.

So I am praying for my future husband and myself to grow strongly toward God until the day that we meet. God has no obligation to answer that prayer with "yes." He has no obligation to give me breath or a heartbeat tomorrow, for that matter.

Is this depressing? Well, it's deep and intense and hard to deal with. But I'd rather deal with truth, even if it's difficult. And then there's faith, which is "knowing that God is, and that He delights to reward those who diligently seek Him." I appreciate the rewards even more, I think, when I realize that they are not something I am due. :)

[68. Nickolina said the following at 3:50 PM on Sep 30:]

68

"it's important to respond meaningfully to this generation of grieving Christian singles who missed out on marriage. "There's more to life than marriage, marriage is hard" is fine for the very young, but those who are looking around themselves at the reality of declining marriage rates (which get worse with each year), WE MUST DROP THE USUAL CLICHES AND PLATITUDES, if our witness is to be genuine."

If the usual cliches and platitudes are an accurate picture of your experience, would that count as genuine witness? The reason many of them become platitudes and cliches is the universality of application. Yes, there are exceptions, but not that many.

"There's more to life than marriage, marriage is hard" is not just "fine for the very young", it is one facet of the trials and tribulations Jesus spoke of and the speaker may have been trying to put things in that perspective. Is "rejoice, I have overcome the world" trite?

Learning to be "content in whatever state I am in" is a universal lesson that applies to all areas of life. Contentment does not mean you have no unfulfilled desires or responsibility to act on desire wisely, it means you are trusting God today. I am content with my house, but I still have to clean it and maintain it: one is an attitude, the other a responsibility.

If I were talking directly to a "grieving single" my words would be dependent upon the interchange. Grieving people need presence rather than sermons. There's a time factor, a relationship factor, and a prayer factor among many other details. My experience, the "comfort with which I have been comforted", is how I learn to comfort others. If we weren't all human, we wouldn't be able to comfort each other. Humans are barely adequate when it comes to communicating, so we tend to say what has been said to us if it seems to fit.

Posts are limited to the words typed and the attitude they are read in. My posts are edited before I post 'em and the presence of a preview button indicates most of us read our words before posting. I do not think the writers intend their words to be considered trite or meaningless. The effort spent indicates a concern that their words be taken seriously.

[69. Jennifer said the following at 7:28 PM on Sep 30:]

69

"If the usual cliches and platitudes are an accurate picture of your experience, would that count as genuine witness?"

It can be, if the person you're talking to has had a much different experience, which I think is the case when those married a couple of decades ago try to encourage singles today. You can be incredibly well-intended but miss the mark, if you are not well informed -- or are at least willing to be filled in on some of the things that have changed, as detailed by Candice Watters, Debbie Maken, Julia Duin and others who have been writing lately about Christian singleness -- ignore them at your peril, if your desire is to reach out to singles.

What they are saying is that the old contentment sermons just aren't cutting it anymore, if anything, they only serve to alienate singles rather than inspire them. They have not become platitudes and cliches because of their "universality of application" but because of their effectiveness in shutting people up.

"Is rejoice, I have overcome the world" trite?

It can be, if spoken too soon, too often, or for the wrong reasons. Some people think that Bible verses are magic, that quoting them can only do good, not harm. This is not the case and is one thing that alienates those on the edge of church, because of losses or disillusionment. I think I hear you saying that you'd ordinarily use more discretion than that, which is good. So I hope you read those articles I've mentioned, because you might want to add some updated understanding your message to singles.

[70. Sarah P. said the following at 8:04 AM on Oct 1:]

70

You have a lot of wisdom, Nickolina, and you write well. Have you ever considered publishing a book?

[71. Nickolina said the following at 12:43 PM on Oct 4:]

71

I think the bottom of this page has strayed from the original topic....

in reply to #69, you are right in observing that it is easy to stray into the state of not hearing each other. Have you noticed how a statement from your mom that once caused eye-rolling now makes sense? There's a lot of factors involved in profitable discussions and time is one of them.

I don't consider myself having a "ministry to singles"; I have a ministry to those God has put in my sphere and it includes a number of singles who talk to me quite often. We are a homeschool family, they tend to be less age-segregated; now that all are adult I have more time to do things like read Boundless and expand my horizons (cliche!) but life is still pretty full. I will try to read the articles, thanks for suggesting them.

In reply to #70--I have threatened for years to write a book titled, "How to be the Happy Wife of a Human Husband" and finally caved to pressure and started a blog called Human Husband/Happy Wife. Definitely off topic! And if I got paid, it'd be easier to justify the time spent.

[72. Idumi said the following at 12:00 AM on Oct 8:]

72

Sorry for dropping in your comment.