Learning From Mom and Dad
by
Heather Koerner
on Mar 12, 2008 at 12:55 PM
I've had a couple of interesting conversations over the last couple of weeks.
The first was with my sister-in-law. After discussing the upcoming presidential primary in our state, she told me, "Well, I talked to my Dad about it and, after hearing what he had to say, it really made me reconsider who I'm going to vote for."
Huh, I thought. Talk to your dad about who to vote for? I hadn't done this. In fact, hadn't even thought about it. Fast forward a couple of days. I'm chatting with a girlfriend about whether she plans to enroll her child in a private Christian school.
"My husband and I are still talking about it," she told me. "But my parents are coming up this weekend and we really want to talk to them about it."
Again ... huh. Neither my husband nor I talked to our parents about our kids' education.
So, for the past couple of weeks, these two conversations have been bouncing around my head. Then, while reading Sacred Parenting by Gary Thomas, I read the following quote from Peyton Manning, NFL quarterback and former Super Bowl MVP.
Later in life, when someone asked Peyton how he felt earning more for playing one game than his dad earned for an entire season, Peyton replied with a clipped, "I don't compete with my father. I learn from him."
Even Ted goes and talks about asking his dad for counsel (though that was about leftovers).
Which got me to wondering, do I still learn from my parents and mentors? Am I still teachable? Or, have I left behind godly counsel like I left my childhood home?
I'm doing a study of Proverbs by Beth Moore and this issue of accepting godly counsel is coming up quite a bit. We need to get over the idea that we know it all, Moore said in this week's lesson, and, instead, we need to be "small on ego, big on effectiveness." The fact is that I don't know it all. The fact is that there are wiser, more mature Christians all around me and I should be grateful, not avoiding, their counsel. Especially on the important issues of life.
To be sure, there need to be guidelines. I should only seek the wisdom of those with godly fruit in their lives. And I should test their advice against Scripture. But as God tells me, He has provided me with counsel and He wants me to trust Him. I need to make sure I do both.
1. Amir Larijani had the following to say on Mar 12 at 1:00 PM:
Heather:
The more and more I live life, the more I am convinced of how much my dad knows. Even though he is not a Christian--he is a Muslim who emigrated to the States in the 1960s and became a naturalized citizen--he is often very insightful with respect to most practical matters of living.
I have no compunction about bounding ideas off him. In fact, I usually converse with him at least twice a week.
2. Eliza had the following to say on Mar 12 at 1:35 PM:
Talk about a sore issue for me! My parents (especially mother) were real big on "train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he'll not depart from it." Although technically they allowed me to make my own decisions, they always made it very clear what they--and by insinuation, God--thought about it. They put the kibosh on my first two relationships (at age 19 and 21), and after that we had a conversation that lasted several years on what it means to "honor your parents". My mom tried to convince me that Ephesians 6 meant that regardless of how old I was, I needed to obey them, since they were my parents and God intended for them to "instruct" me. I finally had enough of the manipulative authority card when I was 24, in grad school, and started dating a wonderful Christian man. All of my friends and the elders at our church highly respected him and I and our relationship, but my parents did everything they could to break us up. We did break up eventually for 6 months because my boyfriend wanted to do the honorable thing. Thankfully my father came around in that time and decided I was an adult and could make my own decisions, and I've now been married to him for 7 months (and it's been amazing so far!).
However, I still cannot even think about my mother without something very close to rage at the way she distorted and manipulated God's word to try to control me. I doubt I will ever be able to ask her opinion again. I just hope I am able to come to a place of reconciliation while we are both on this planet. I really envy people who can just chat with their parents and ask their advice, and whose parents are honest and respectful back towards their children. But unfortunately not all Christian families are happy and functional.
3. Leah T. had the following to say on Mar 12 at 1:40 PM:
"The more and more I live life, the more I am convinced of how much my dad knows."
I have to second that thought, which is kind of incredible in one sense. I had a really rocky relationship with my Dad growing up and for a long time, didn't entirely trust his opinion/perspective/advice. To make matters worse, he's Samoan and grew up in the islands and has always had a few attitudes that were entirely grounded in a culture that I wasn't raised in (which therefore, really make very little sense to me). Thanks to the grace of God, a lot of the hurt and mistrust of the past is now healed and I can see both just how rebellious I was, and how wise and patient my Dad has been (in some ways though, he's still a crazy backwards Samoan).
My mom, on the other hand, is an absolute gem. I don't know where I'd be without her Godly wisdom, advice, and example.
4. Christina had the following to say on Mar 12 at 2:21 PM:
Yeah...I still ask dad for political advise. We tend to have our mini debates and come to a conclusion. I don't always agree with him, which bugs him to no end, but I usually learn a lot more about the candidates from getting his PoV than without it.
I still ask mum on the best tactics on how to clean the house. I know I'll be asking that even more when i get married, start having kids, and have more to do and seemingly less time.
And on the subject of what I have learned from my parents...I made a blog post about this on one of my blogs just the other night...when I was cleaning my bathroom, I did my mental checklist to ensure everything was done. Its the same checklist my mother taught me when I was 11 or 12 - the 4 T's of Bathroom Cleaning.
*Tub
*Tile
*Toilet
*Tink
5. a sassy sister had the following to say on Mar 12 at 2:46 PM:
I think Heather's points about learning from Mom and Dad is great. However, I think we must keep in mind there's a line between receiving counsel for our parents and being totally dependent on our parents for counsel(i.e. we cannot dissect between our own individual thoughts, ideas, and decisions, and our parents'.)
6. DannieA had the following to say on Mar 12 at 3:05 PM:
My parents know A WHOLE LOT and it would be silly of me to try to do something monumental and not ask their advice.
Unfortunately, I know some people don't have that luxury....
but if you do....even if you moved out and think you're a know it all...I'd consider you asking for advice.
7. Mrs. B had the following to say on Mar 12 at 3:58 PM:
What about when your parents *aren't* good counsel?
This is a frustrating subject for me because I can't really talk to either of my parents and get godly counsel. I didn't grow up in a Christian home and in many ways I took care of my parents more than they took care of me. I never really asked them for advice - rather, they asked me for advice. If I act like I don't know what to do they seem astonished that I don't have all the answers. Especially in high school it was like I was the parent and they were my kids and I kept having to help them be responsible.
Even now that I'm grown up, my parents are divorced, and my relationship with them has changed, I still see the effects of this unbalanced relationship. I've been "self-sufficient" in many ways for a long time, and now I'm all grown up and realizing I have no one to talk to about grown-up questions. More often that not I make decisions knowing what my mom or dad would do and then do the opposite as that's probably the more responsible thing.
Most of my church's population is very young - mid to late 20s, and I'm in my early 20s. I've gotten to know some older adults through various programs at church but no relationship has stuck by way of mentorship. I am honestly really jealous of people who can call their parents for advice because I feel like I have no wise older counsel to talk to.
So does anyone have suggestions on how a mentoring relationship can begin?
8. April L. had the following to say on Mar 12 at 4:33 PM:
Eliza (comment 2),
I was deeply saddened to read your post. I've always looked forward to my married years (whenever they happen to come) as a time made even more enjoyable by sharing things with my mom and getting her advice about everything from appreciating my husband to pregnancy problems to childrearing ideas.
Although I did not have relationships to muddy the waters, my parents and I did have the "honoring" talks a lot, into my early twenties.
I was mad, frustrated, cried a lot, and had to learn a bunch of tough things at that time in my life. But one day I finally made a decision. I knew I should honor my parents. I couldn't find any biblical directives for avoiding it. So I just closed my eyes, took a deep breath, and plunged in. One big thing I had going for me was that my parents NEVER, and I mean NEVER EVER, have asked me to do something against the Bible.
Anyway, it was rocky. It turned out to be, as I realized later, a battle against Self. But I am now full of joy - the bad feelings are gone - and my mom is my best friend.
My friend, if you haven't prayed over this earnestly, start now. Pray till all the rage is gone. Confess what you know to have been wrong in your relationship with your parents. And take a leap of faith - it seems as if showing honor will undermine your rights and your opinions, but God will bless you. He IS a God of reconciliation! Read the "Love" chapter in 1 Corinthians and apply it to your relationship with your mom.
Your marriage sounds wonderful! But if there is this huge rift still between you and your mother, it will make a difference. Something that helps me when I am upset with my parents: I think of how I hope MY daughters will feel about me...
I will be praying for you too.
9. Erin had the following to say on Mar 12 at 4:54 PM:
great post Heather. i've found this in my own life as well. i am just now learning the value of the Godly counsel of pastors, respected friends and parents. indispensable. thanks.
10. Laurie had the following to say on Mar 12 at 6:21 PM:
My parents are great sources of wisdom and counsel. I do not always agree with what they tell me, and I have not always gotten along well with my mom, but lately I have seen clear blessings from God after I chose to honor my parents and their wishes even when I was frustrated by what they wanted (they were not asking me anything unBiblical, just something we disagreed on). I have seen the wisdom of their advice and God has blessed me for honoring them. Now we are closer and I love being with them and getting their take on things. I have just begun to realize how having Godly, Christian parents has helped me to become the person I am today - thanks to God. I used to take my parents for granted, now I see how vitally important they are, and were when I was little!
11. Sam had the following to say on Mar 13 at 8:31 AM:
My father and grandfather are the two people I go to for advice on everything. They are my sounding boards. I don't know what I'd do without them!
12. cathys had the following to say on Mar 13 at 10:44 AM:
Growing up, ours was a family that kept everything to ourselves. Talking, especially about problems or fears, was not encouraged. It was actually discouraged. As an adult now, having been "on my own" for a number of years, I try to talk to my mom and ask her for counsel. To this day she has a problem giving me counsel. And when she does, she often tells me not to listen because she feels that her counsel is not biblical, just her opinion.
I am actually now talking to one of her friends that I have known all of my life and getting advice from her as a mentor. How did I find her? Well, I needed some counsel and I looked for a godly woman who I knew fairly well and asked her advice. It kind of grew from there as the situation changed. Just recently I decided to go ahead and ask her to pray about mentoring me officially, and she agreed. Praise the Lord! This was an answer to prayer!
13. Eliza had the following to say on Mar 13 at 1:47 PM:
April #8,
Thank you for your comments. Of course I have done quite a bit of earnest praying on the subject. There is actually quite a bit more to the story, including some abuse that needs to be dealt with before the relationship can be mended. I have to pretty much completely reconstruct my understanding of God, since my previous faulty understanding was entirely founded on guilt and fear. I also am not going to put myself in the position of being manipulated and discouraged by her again, and it's going to take a while to figure out those boundaries. Naturally only God can take care of this, but it is not going to happen overnight. I can work on changing myself, but there is nothing I can do to change her.
14. S. had the following to say on Mar 13 at 3:43 PM:
Eliza, I believe we conversed on another thread - female self-pleasure. I, too, had a very rocky relationship with my mom - punctuated by significant manipulation and emotional blackmail on her side - and I never only really began to understand how unhealthy the relationship was this past year. Remarkably, with working through this and gaining forgiveness, recognizing how God's love takes on an entirely different form than what I had thought, I have begun to gain emotional health altogether and even achieve mastery over that desperately difficult addiction (as I mentioned in the other thread).
I don't believe that "honor your father and mother" as an adult means that you have to ask their advice constantly or even follow it when it is offered. It means that you appreciate whatever love and care they did put into your upbringing, no matter how small (and in my case it was actually a tremendous amount, once I could see properly). There's no particular reason why I should be "due" any amount of sacrifice or care from anyone. If you have kind, wise, loving parents, such an understanding will often lead into the asking and giving of wise advice as an outgrowth of the inner condition.
15. Eliza had the following to say on Mar 14 at 9:11 AM:
S.,
Thank you for your comments. I'm sure you were really aiming to encourage me. However, I'm seeing that what I really need to do is just keep my mouth shut (fingers off the keys) about really personal things. Whenever I say something about which I feel particularly vulnerable I end up getting either advice or "victory stories", both of which are simply not helpful. My reaction every time is closer to tears of frustration than feeling uplifted.
The only reason I write what I do is to make the point: sometimes life just sucks. Being a Christian does not mean that everything works out for you or that you are always on the verge of "victory." And I know everyone believes that in their head, but when it comes down to actually interacting with someone in a Job-like situation, the first instinct is to try to cheer them up. I guess this is because they're just uncomfortable.
Anyway, I know everyone is trying their best to be helpful and loving. I just need to be more choosy in what I say, because this is not an appropriate forum for really getting to know someone.
16. faye had the following to say on Mar 14 at 9:30 AM:
I'm finding that, as I grow older, the choice is mine. Regardless of who started the "fight", it is my responsibility to love and forgive and move on. If I don't learn to do this, the pain will only grow and relationships will take on a lonely face.
I cannot change my mom. BUT, I can change my reaction to her comments. If I stay real and loving to her, I know I'm giving God the glory and I'm being honest. My mom is a very loving person, but when we're together there's always a struggle. I still have hope for our relationship and each new day I know we are closer to being better. If I trust these words:
"By His wounds, we are healed,"
then there is HOPE for both of us.
The world will tell us that if we've been hurt, we can move on and forget about that person- or worse, we have a right to be bitter. I look to Christ and see, it is much better to live free! There is a better way to live when I've been hurt; and it's not by harboring the pain and lashing out- even if I think it's just and right.
17. S. had the following to say on Mar 14 at 2:30 PM:
Eliza: You're right. I don't know you. Sometimes life just stinks. But seeing as how you can't change your mom, the only thing you can change is the rage on your end. I can say I've been there, but you don't know if that's true or not, and it sure doesn't change the fact that you have your own pain to live. My heart goes out to you.
As for my "victory" story, I walk it out daily with fear and trembling. It led me this past year through my own deepest, darkest, deathlike depression. Nothing easy or simple about squeezing through by God's amazing grace when all feelings scream that you are dead and God has abandoned you to Hell.
May Christ walk with you in His power.
18. Jo had the following to say on Mar 18 at 4:53 AM:
Eliza,
I know how you feel. Not about the parents situation, but about feeling more upset when people try to advise or encourage. Some things in life really do suck, and no amount of 'God works things together for good' quoting is going to change the fact that our world is fallen and our suffering is real and painful. From what I've read of your posts you seem to have had a difficult journey and I admire the fact that you've fought to reconstruct your faith where many would have simply given up on God altogether.
Anyway if it would help at all to talk to someone outside your 'real' life but not on a public forum like this, you'd be welcome to email me. And if it wouldn't help in the slightest then you can just ignore that. :)
19. Rachael had the following to say on Mar 18 at 10:15 AM:
Hi Eliza,
About getting and giving advice -- I think we can remember that it's one beggar telling another beggar where to find bread. Really our answers lie in the promises of God. Of course it's easier to believe that with the head than with the heart. But what I need to ask myself is: "Do I believe this or do I not?"
You know, just last night I was at a BS and requested prayer for perspective. Not sure if anyone prayed for that for me, but I requested prayer for it. I want perspective and to be at peace even if I can't reach 'explicit peace' with someone. It bothers(ed?) me tremendously. But you know what? A thought has come to me. That verse we may treat as a cliche if we've heard it a million times.
Phil. 4:6-7: "do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God. And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus."
I'm going to try to 'take God up on this offer'. I want that peace even though I don't have 'peace' with that person, so, I must be anxious. Am I supposed to have anxiety? No. So what should I do? Pray. With thanksgiving.
Is this a victory story for you? No. But this verse came to me. Sure, I may never have 'explicit peace' with that person. My head told me that God could close the wound even if there's not a human peaceful closure. But my heart didn't/doesn't feel it, and I'm not/wasn't sure how to pinpoint how to approach this issue. But somehow it's exciting to know where the peace can be found.
Recently I heard someone say something like, "Our testimonies don't end." So true. He who began a good work in us will be faithful to complete it (see Phil. 1:6). And as someone said last night: "We never arrived but we have arrived."
Thankfully God didn't abandon us at the point of receiving Him. He'll carry us the rest of the way.
"Grace that brought us safe thus far, and Grace will lead us home."